3.5 revision? Martial weapon types?

[RangerWickett]

I recall reading something somewhere a while ago that the martial weapon proficiency feat gave you proficiency in a group of weapons. So you could take MWP - Axe and know how to fight with every sort of martial axe.

This change made sense to me, if not necessarily from a real-world perspective, at least from a balance perspective. Sure, a huge two-hander is a lot different from a battle-axe, but if you spent a feat and could only use one weapon, that seems like poor incentive. PCs would be more encouraged to just multiclass into fighters and get them all.

The thing is, I haven't seen this posted anywhere. Could someone tell me if this is the case? Or did I just misread something?

 

[Shard O'Glase]

that was something we scooped from a dungeon amgazine. It didn't pan out though and apparently its for a specific weapon. Why anyone would take this feat when they can wait a couple levels and get an exotic prof r get them all with1 level of quite a few classes I don't know.

 

[RangerWickett]

that was something we scooped from a dungeon amgazine. It didn't pan out though and apparently its for a specific weapon. Why anyone would take this feat when they can wait a couple levels and get an exotic prof r get them all with1 level of quite a few classes I don't know.

So the martial weapon proficiency still only gives you one weapon? Aicaramba. Ah well, I'll be changing that. I kinda like the idea of different weapon groups. Lesse.

Swords - shortsword, longsword, scimitar, rapier, greatsword, falchion

Axes - Throwing axe, handaxe, battle axe, great axe

Picks - light pick, heavy pick, scythe

Lances - light, heavy

Flails - sap, light flail, heavy flail

Polearms - trident, glaive, guisarme, halberd, longspear, ranseur

Bows - shortbow, longbow, and composite varieties

 

[Olive]

Swords - shortsword, longsword, scimitar, rapier, greatsword, falchion

Now I'm no sword fighter, but I do know that the difference is fighting with a scimictar as opposed to a rapier is pretty big. So I can kinda understand why they didn't change this. Not to mention the difference between different types of polearm...

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

Andy Collins discussed this on his boards about a week back. He said he wanted to do something like RangerWickett suggested (so that weapon feats didn't apply to a specific weapon), but they eventually decided that the change required was too dramatic for the revision.

 

[Shard O'Glase]

your kidding right?

With all the other changes they have something as small as this which really wouldn't alter characters in a dramatic fashion at all was too big of a change.

If they had changed this it would of been on my list of the smallest and most invisible changes in the revision.

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

Would I kid? I just reports 'em, I don't judge 'em.

This brings up another one of those "if we could have started over, we'd probably do it differently" things.

I strongly dislike the effect of the "choose a weapon: you're better using it than normal" feats. Had I my druthers, they'd all be gone or changed to encompass a wider range of weapon choices.

These feats create a situation where characters are loathe to change from a specific weapon because of the feat investment they've made.

By 4th level, the average fighter's spent at least two feats on a specific weapon (Focus and Specialization, and maybe also Exotic Proficiency and/or Finesse). By 8th, throw in Improved Crit and you're up to 3, 4, or even 5 feats on a single weapon. Assuming that 8th-level fighter is wielding a bastard sword, what are the odds that he's willing to try out the new (and maybe even better) battleaxe or warhammer he just found in the dragon's treasure hoard? Zero. That puts an ugly design restriction on the DM--put in the right weapon, or it's nothing more than a bunch of gold pieces in portable form.

Changing all the weapon-specific feats in the PH wasn't a realistic option--players are too attached to them. But Weapon Finesse seemed like a reasonable (and simple) place to "sneak" the concept in to see how players liked it. As a result, the new Weapon Finesse feat grants the finesse ability for all light weapons (and a small selection of other weapons, including the rapier). It's a boon to the rogue or ranger, who might not have the feats to spend on getting really good at a specific weapon, and now has the flexibility to wield a variety of light weapons as appropriate to the situation.

Andy Collins
Senior Designer
Wizards of the Coast Roleplaying R&D

 

[Shard O'Glase]

I can quasi see where there coming from I guess on the testing it level. Throw it out see how it flys and maybe the offical 4e will go this way. But martial weapon prof would of been even a smaller change IMO as weapon finesse or maybe on the same level. i think they fell down on not making this one of the test feats as well.

 

[Dagredhel]

I'm pretty sure that they broke down weapon proficiency feats by type (broad categories of similar weapons) in the Everquest RPG.

 

[Paladin]

I bet they'll introduce this concept in The Complete Warrior, after all - what better place for variant combat-oriented feats?