[3.5] Revision Spotlight - Druid class

[Shard O'Glase]

But what specifically would you recommend, Mr O'Glase? To wit: which weapons?

It's rather rude to call the changes "wussy" without having some specific recommendations of your own.

Who cares what the specific weapons are. I don't think there's any agument that certain classes should be limited in proficiency in various weapons and armor. The wizard has there meager list, the rogue a little better, the druid about the same all well and good, a limited list is needed for balance purposes. And while your making that list limited sure make it styalistically appropriate for the class.

The specifics of the list isn't my gripe as I think anyone can see. My gripe is the lame, nah moronic flavor restricitons that only appear on the druid. What clerics don't make spiritual oaths? Or maybe they removed their heads out of their butts and relaized when making the cleric, flavor restrictions belong in setting books not in the core book.

About the only thing worse than lame core book flavor restricitons like the druids armor and monk and paladin multiclassing restrictions is my spelling and grammar.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

Druids are already kickass in 3.0, in 3.5 they are overboard. Bigger, better, faster, more. Yay.

We don't have all the info. For instance, it looks like animal companions are weaker, as is animal growth.

 

[Shard O'Glase]

Is it my imagination, or has the satyr picture taken a dramatic turn for the worse?

maybe but that nymph picture is a turn for the better. The satyr picture looks like the art form the psioics handbook, which i liked the art for. The astyr looks ok to me but I don't remember the M picture so I can't compare it.

 

[Shard O'Glase]

We don't have all the info. For instance, it looks like animal companions are weaker, as is animal growth.

Yeah but this glimpse does look like a powerup. And druids did not need one of those at all. Without seeing the spell lists, new animal companions etc we don't know. But if it is a powerup they screwed up.

I like the idea of spontaneous summoning but its dang powerful, I wonder if its a full round aciton of a full round. In 3e the spells were full round so it wuld seem wierd to me to reduce the sponataneous casting time to less than the spells casting time, so maybe its either a full round, or they reduced the summoning casting time. I hope for number 2, its way too hard to get the summoning spells off in a fight for the power they give you through most the spell levels.

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

Who cares what the specific weapons are. I don't think there's any agument that certain classes should be limited in proficiency in various weapons and armor. The wizard has there meager list, the rogue a little better, the druid about the same all well and good, a limited list is needed for balance purposes. And while your making that list limited sure make it styalistically appropriate for the class.

The specifics of the list isn't my gripe as I think anyone can see. My gripe is the lame, nah moronic flavor restricitons that only appear on the druid. What clerics don't make spiritual oaths? Or maybe they removed their heads out of their butts and relaized when making the cleric, flavor restrictions belong in setting books not in the core book.

So what I hear you saying is: while you know what wrong looks like, you don't know what right looks like. You dislike the druid's weapon list because it's based on arbitrary flavor restrictions, but you don't have a suggestion for what the weapon list should be with the flavor restrictions removed. Very constructive criticism, that.

IMO, all weapon restrictions are essentially arbitrary and exist for balance purposes only. If you look at the 3.5 druid weapon list, you'll notice there's no "flavor" reason given in the text for the weapon restriction (unlike the armor restriction). It just is. Since the authors aren't trying to justify the weapon list with any particular reasoning, I'm absolutely fine with it as is. Why isn't the bow (or insert other weapon) on the list? Because it isn't -- it's arbitrary. I'd recommend Simple Weapon Proficiency as a mechanically simpler solution, but I'm not up in arms about it.

The real point I'm trying to make is that if you're going to criticize something, it gives your argument more weight if you suggest a viable alternative. Saying "This sucks!" or, "This sucks because of X" isn't nearly as persuasive as: "This sucks because of X, but if it were Y instead, it would be better because of Z."

 

[Shard O'Glase]

My constructive criticism is to remove the religious oath on the ARMOR. I've said or implied this heavily in all 3 of the posts on this subject. The religious oath on the armor is a needless flavor restriciton. If you still don't understand what I'm saying and that there has always been a viable alternative in my posts there's nothing more I can do.

 

[Number47]

With a list (though it isn't posted) of how animal companions grow better over levels, I think we just got a big roleplaying boost. I never liked how the druid had to constantly send away his previous companions to trade up.

 

[jasamcarl]

Yeah but this glimpse does look like a powerup. And druids did not need one of those at all. Without seeing the spell lists, new animal companions etc we don't know. But if it is a powerup they screwed up.

I like the idea of spontaneous summoning but its dang powerful, I wonder if its a full round aciton of a full round. In 3e the spells were full round so it wuld seem wierd to me to reduce the sponataneous casting time to less than the spells casting time, so maybe its either a full round, or they reduced the summoning casting time. I hope for number 2, its way too hard to get the summoning spells off in a fight for the power they give you through most the spell levels.

Care to elaborate on what you think is particularly unbalanced about the druid depicted here?

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

Yeah but this glimpse does look like a powerup. And druids did not need one of those at all.

If the druid received several nerfs then it would need a power-up.

What, exactly, made the druid so strong? IME it wasn't the animal companions, it was the animal growthed animal companions. And entangle.

 

[Kai Lord]

The new "Wodland stride" is a rape of the druid archetype. How am I supposed to play my woodland-striding druid if he can only stride through wods? I for one am very upset with WotC for listening to all the fanboys on this. Further, notice spot and listen are now druid skills. Combined with wildshape this makes them better scouts than a rogue.

This isn't a druid, it's a wodderogue.

Freaking. Awesome. Post.