3e and the Test of Time

[diaglo]

All the girls were so much prettier when I was 15.

These girls today...they lack a special something.

I mean, Staci, the first girl I ever kissed, back in 1989? They just don't build girls like that anymore.

And the music is not as good. And the sky is not as blue.

what are you talking about?

have you seen some of the girls of today? i feel like a dirty old man.... wait ... i am a dirty old man.

 

[Kirin'Tor]

None of your reasons for having such a great game have anything to do with 3e.

Right...having a good time has little, if anything, to do with the system you play. Doesn't that undermine your point?

I'm a big 3.X D&D fan, but I've had great games in 2e Ravenloft & Planescape...I also enjoyed a Traveller game & a Shadowrun game, both of which I barely grasped the system behind.

I think this whole thread is really about the human qualities of nostalgia & resistance to change: I could've run my 3.5e Realms game, or my 3.5e generic-setting game in 2e or 1e (if I knew them better) and have had no less or more fun with the roleplayers in my group....

The people you played with, and their style of gaming, are what you remember as being present in the old D&D that isn't in D&D 3
...maybe that has to do with the other players style of play, or yours; or maybe it has to do with the DM & his style vs. the players or the DMs style vs. your old DMs style.
Style of play has more impact on a game than the rules behind it: if you like to play immersive games & everyone else wants kick-in-the-door, you could run a game in a rules-less LARP system, and they'd still punch anything with a weapon before you spoke to it.

 

[Ankh-Morpork Guard]

Some people say that the toolkit approach is great. It's fine for a board game approach, but not for a RPG.

It works perfectly for GURPS. If that's not a toolkit approach, I don't know WHAT is. And anyway, the whole toolkit approach seems to be working just fine with 3e, too. And if it DIDN'T work, all of uf would be agreeing with you.

 

[diaglo]

By the way, I started with Basic in 1980, so I think I can consider myself a grognard.

btw, you can think all you want. some times it doesn't make it so....

the path of a grognard is Chainmail > Original D&D > Original D&D > Original D&D....

the one you proposed is less inviting.

 

[Psion]

The rules are dry. They lack the imagination and prose that brought previous games to life. And they tend to be overly complex when they do not need to be.

Some people say that the toolkit approach is great. It's fine for a board game approach, but not for a RPG.

Thanks.

I share your assessment that it is more of a toolkit, if not your judgement about their contribution to the game. For me, I stuck with D&D precisely because it did not come with a default setting like nearly every other game seemed to and let me create things using the toolkit, and of course, I find 3e is great in this regard.

But clearly, to me, this seems to be a case of diff'rent strokes for diff'rent folks. I rather like that it is more of a toolkit. I feel that with opening up support to other publishers, we also have more creative input than we ever had.

 

[Belen]

Nonstalgia- that seems to be the only response to criticisms of 3e these days. I play 3e. I am not pining away for any of the older editions, although I do not feel the need to dislike them as much as others.

Is it my fault that I fall asleep reading the 3e books? I think not.

 

[DaveMage]

If you want 3/3.5E to stand the test of time, just go out and buy the World's Largest Dungeon.

By the time you finish with it, you will probably be into a new generation...

And 3E will certainly stand the test of time with me. In addtion to the WLD, I have dozens of published adventures that will need to be played before I try any new version...

 

[JPL]

Is it my fault that I fall asleep reading the 3e books? I think not.

You're right, man. If you don't like it, there must be something wrong with it.

 

[MerricB]

I fall asleep reading the 2E rulebooks and the oD&D rulebooks.

Only the AD&D rulebooks have Gygax's flair, and it is only a small portion of them.

What distinguishes 2E are the world supplements.

Cheers!

 

[Abstraction]

btw, you can think all you want. some times it doesn't make it so....

the path of a grognard is Chainmail > Original D&D > Original D&D > Original D&D....

the one you proposed is less inviting.

If definition of grognard = what you say, then there are only as many grognards as there will ever be, eventually dying out and becoming extinct.

My definition = Having been with the game(s) for more than half your life. Although I guess that makes my 3-year old daughter a grognard!