4 groups of D&D fans, not 3

[thecasualoblivion]

Its my opinion that there are 4 main groups of D&D fans for 5E to appeal to, not just 4E, 3E/PF, and OSR. There is a 4th group, an important one, that tends to get lumped in within the 3E/PF and OSR crowds yet distinct from both. I call that group "2E", in quotation marks as I would expect few of them to personally associate themselves with that edition.

The main traits of the "2E" group:

1. Favor the playstyle of post-OSR AD&D.
2. Switched to 3E(mostly) and played it as AD&D instead of 3E.
3. Prefer AD&D in a general sense, not a specific sense
4. Don't have a game that is truly their own at this point. AD&D/retroclones are a bit out of date, 3E doesn't really fit the playstyle and is no longer "what everybody plays", and 4E doesn't really fit at all.

 

[am181d]

You seem to be forgetting new gamers. If we don't continue to attract new gamers to the hobby, the hobby will die.

 

[the Jester]

The main traits of the "2E" group:

1. Favor the playstyle of post-OSR AD&D.

I'm confused- what do you mean? AD&D came out long before the OSR games.

2. Switched to 3E(mostly) and played it as AD&D instead of 3E.

Uh... what does this mean? If you are playing 3e, how can you "play it as" AD&D? Are you suggesting that there is a huge inherent difference in playstyle between AD&D and 3e?

3. Prefer AD&D in a general sense, not a specific sense

Again- I'm not clear on the distinction you're drawing here.

4. Don't have a game that is truly their own at this point. AD&D/retroclones are a bit out of date, 3E doesn't really fit the playstyle and is no longer "what everybody plays", and 4E doesn't really fit at all.

If your preference is 2e, then certainly 2e is "a game of your own", isn't it?

Sure, it isn't "what everybody plays", but that doesn't have any impact on what your preferred game system is- or does it?

Sorry, I'm just not sure what you are getting at here.

 

[Tequila Sunrise]

4. Don't have a game that is truly their own at this point. AD&D/retroclones are a bit out of date, 3E doesn't really fit the playstyle and is no longer "what everybody plays", and 4E doesn't really fit at all.

Is the design team saying that there are only three groups of fans? Or is that a fanmade generalization? Either way, it does indeed seem narrow-minded, because there's always been a group who don't like any edition enough to be called Fans. And it seems like such a group would be worth capturing for WotC.

You seem to be forgetting new gamers. If we don't continue to attract new gamers to the hobby, the hobby will die.

Yeah, but new gamers will pretty much buy whatever's on the shelf or play whatever their gaming group is playing. So as a group they don't need to be specifically catered to.

 

[JamesonCourage]

You seem to be forgetting new gamers. If we don't continue to attract new gamers to the hobby, the hobby will die.

I think the premise is that there is four groups of D&D fans. People not in the hobby can't be fans of it yet, really. (I'm not saying new players should be ignored, just that I don't think he forgot new games; they're just not involved with being "D&D fans" as his post was talking about.) As always, play what you like

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Someone said in another discussion that 3E worked fine if you played it like AD&D. So I figure it could very well be that this may be partially it's own group. 3E doesn't work exactly anymore (it's mostly out of print like AD&D, and once you know what you can do if you play it differently than AD&D and what it gives you, it's hard to put the genie back in the bottle), Pathfinder moved further away from AD&D, and 4E as well. And OSR games go before AD&D,I presume.

It could very well be that each edition of D&D is its own group...

 

[Yora]

I say there are 27 groups.

 

[Iosue]

I'm confused- what do you mean? AD&D came out long before the OSR games.

I think what TCO is saying is that the OSR reflects a certain style of play associated with OD&D, and early BD&D/AD&D. I.e., dungeon exploration, somewhat gritty, high reliance on "player skill" over "character abilities". The fans he's talking about played 2e, but not in that style. Their style was closer to storytelling type games, influenced by TSR novels and the large number of settings.

Uh... what does this mean? If you are playing 3e, how can you "play it as" AD&D? Are you suggesting that there is a huge inherent difference in playstyle between AD&D and 3e?

Playing 3e in a "2e" style would mean they didn't exploit 3e's character generation abilities as much as they could have, nor would they have relied on grid and minis. They would have played it with the same expectations and tropes as in AD&D. No CLW wands, etc.

Again- I'm not clear on the distinction you're drawing here.

I believe he's saying they liked the settings and tropes of 90s era AD&D, but they weren't particularly wedded to mechanics. Thus, they made a smooth transition to 3e from 2e, rather than hold out.

If your preference is 2e, then certainly 2e is "a game of your own", isn't it?

Sure, it isn't "what everybody plays", but that doesn't have any impact on what your preferred game system is- or does it?

Their preference is not 2e in specific, but the general tenor of play of 90s D&D. They'd be just as happy with 3e and their preferred TSR campaign setting (or homebrew derivative thereof). But it's hard to find people who want to play 2e anymore, and the 3e games available may not be to their taste in terms of style of character generation and rule interaction.

 

[the Jester]

Okay, that makes sense.

In which case, I say that 1e players are a separate category.

 

[JRRNeiklot]

You seem to be forgetting new gamers. If we don't continue to attract new gamers to the hobby, the hobby will die.

I'd argue that more new gamers come in from word of mouth, recruitment by current players than a new edition will ever draw in. There's 11 people that I play with. Four of us have been playing since the 70s/80s. The others were all introduced to the game by the four of us. Some were friends or relatives, others we recruited from LFGS', or online. None came into the hobby due to a new release of D&D. If you want new gamers, your game has to appeal to OLD gamers first.