And the Halflings broke it. And with no gods to fix it, arcane magic was corrupted.
So People went to a supernatural path that doesn't use the Weave nor relied on deities: Psionics.
D&D 5E 5e has everything it needs for Dark Sun
- Thread starter ChaosOS
- Start date
So People went to a supernatural path that doesn't use the Weave nor relied on deities: Psionics.
Yaarel
🇮🇱 🇺🇦 He-Mage
5e in both the MM and Tashas, says Psionics is "spellcasting", thus by definition engages the Weave and creates magical effects by means of the Weave.
The mind isnt magic, but the Weave is.
Yaarel
🇮🇱 🇺🇦 He-Mage
Apparently, in Dark Sun,
Defiling magic unleashes the magical energy inherent in the alchemical element of Water. Water is lifeforce and healing. This destruction of Water seems like the magical equivalent of unleashing nuclear forces.
The destruction of Water is a source of great arcane energy. However the destruction of Water has consequences.
Preservation magic lacks the extreme energy of Water destruction, but it is a sustainable magical resource.
Defiling magic unleashes the magical energy inherent in the alchemical element of Water. Water is lifeforce and healing. This destruction of Water seems like the magical equivalent of unleashing nuclear forces.
The destruction of Water is a source of great arcane energy. However the destruction of Water has consequences.
Preservation magic lacks the extreme energy of Water destruction, but it is a sustainable magical resource.
Last edited:
AdmundfortGeographer
Getting lost in fantasy maps
Eh.
That is a level of detail about what happens that is too much, IMO.
The function of defiling is best kept abstract for DMs to describe as they desire.
ph0rk
Friendship is Magic, and Magic is Heresy.
5e's take on psionics is so far removed from the original ideas and conversations about those ideas I wouldn't give the flavor stuff a second thought.
Psionics was, first and foremost, about spell points vs Vancian slots. Dark Sun's fluff came later, and it would be just as complex as, say, Dragonlance's take on magic would be on top of normal 5e stuff.
cbwjm
Legend
Defiling magic could be something which uses a system similar to piety or even the honour system in the DMG. The more you defile the higher your score granting you benefits when you defile (hence the temptation to defile is always there) and penalties as the defiling magic corrupts your body and soul.
I probably wouldn't even bother mentioning the weave in Dark Sun, it's pretty much just an FR construct which isn't needed in any other setting.
We don't know how they'll present Dark Sun, they likely will remove races since they've done that for other settings, and they may remove classes, both will likely have a sidebar saying that the DM is free to add these if they wish. They might do the opposite and have all classes available and then have a sidebar saying that DMs might want to remove certain classes. I think that ever since they got Ray Winninger as Executive Producer that they are more willing to try out new ideas that would previously be off the table, they've effectively rewritten dragonborn for instance, something that I think previously wouldn't have happened.
They have said that they have 3 old settings they plan to release, Ravenloft is done and if Dark Sun is one of the three, I'm excited to see what they'll do with it, even if it doesn't fit what many purists say has to have/remove X for it to be Dark Sun.
I probably wouldn't even bother mentioning the weave in Dark Sun, it's pretty much just an FR construct which isn't needed in any other setting.
We don't know how they'll present Dark Sun, they likely will remove races since they've done that for other settings, and they may remove classes, both will likely have a sidebar saying that the DM is free to add these if they wish. They might do the opposite and have all classes available and then have a sidebar saying that DMs might want to remove certain classes. I think that ever since they got Ray Winninger as Executive Producer that they are more willing to try out new ideas that would previously be off the table, they've effectively rewritten dragonborn for instance, something that I think previously wouldn't have happened.
They have said that they have 3 old settings they plan to release, Ravenloft is done and if Dark Sun is one of the three, I'm excited to see what they'll do with it, even if it doesn't fit what many purists say has to have/remove X for it to be Dark Sun.
The Weave or it's equivalent is broken in Dark Sun. That's why psionics and druidic magic are used.
You can make Psionics use spells but it has to look visibly different from Arcane and Divine in the players' and characters' to make sense.
Strip that out and you really don't have a core element of Dark Sun.
cbwjm
Legend
I wouldn't say that the equivalent of the weave is broken in Dark Sun, rather I'd say that magic in Dark Sun simply uses life energy as the interface or catalyst to cast spells. It's not broken, just different (well, I guess with the effects of defiling that now you could say that it's broken).
Psionics is a type of spellcasting in D&D because there's no Psionicist Class. Because there is no current framework to present psionic sciences and disciplines.
If a Psionics book were to be released, all the "Psionics is Spellcasting" stuff would be retconned because they'd have the powers and functions. Just like it was in 2e and 3e.
Though if you pay attention to what 5e's designers say: Psionics -can- create spell effects that are subject to things like antimagic zones... but that's not -all- Psionics are. Because while they can create spell-like functions, the rest of what they do doesn't get stopped.
Some people refuse to understand these facts and chooses to believe, wholeheartedly, that Psionics is just magic and the Weave is a perfect design choice rather than a kludge to describe supernatural power.
And you know? Yeah. I'd say that Athas had a Weave, back when the sun was blue and oceans churned and plants bloomed green over most of the world. Athas had a weave when the Pristine Tower was built and burned away the Brown Tide, turning the Sun Yellow. Athas had a weave Rajaat gathered his fifteen. Athas had a weave when the genocidal Cleansing Wars began. But that Weave was defiled, destroyed, and left magic in Athas with tattered remnants of what once was.
Which Rajaat's followers and other Defilers tear apart with the casting of every spell.
But it should also be noted: Athas had Psionics -first-. It was only when the Pyreen formed, Rajaat among them, that Magic was discovered. The Age of Magic came after the Green Age. And it was his magic that made the sun turn from Yellow to Red.
At least... That's the story -I'd- tell, if I were the writers. But they'll probably go for the easier one:
See... Dark Sun is cut off from the rest of the Multiverse. Instead of all kinds of Transitive Planes and Outer Planes and so on and so forth, it only touches two surrounded by a third. The Grey and the Black within the Hollow. The Hollow is oblivion. It is nothingness. And it separates Athas from the rest of the Multiverse. Souls don't go to Arcadia or the Abyss or anywhere fun like that when they die. Spelljammers who try to get to Athas either get destroyed in the Hollow or miraculously make it through and become trapped.
If a Psionics book were to be released, all the "Psionics is Spellcasting" stuff would be retconned because they'd have the powers and functions. Just like it was in 2e and 3e.
Though if you pay attention to what 5e's designers say: Psionics -can- create spell effects that are subject to things like antimagic zones... but that's not -all- Psionics are. Because while they can create spell-like functions, the rest of what they do doesn't get stopped.
Some people refuse to understand these facts and chooses to believe, wholeheartedly, that Psionics is just magic and the Weave is a perfect design choice rather than a kludge to describe supernatural power.
And you know? Yeah. I'd say that Athas had a Weave, back when the sun was blue and oceans churned and plants bloomed green over most of the world. Athas had a weave when the Pristine Tower was built and burned away the Brown Tide, turning the Sun Yellow. Athas had a weave Rajaat gathered his fifteen. Athas had a weave when the genocidal Cleansing Wars began. But that Weave was defiled, destroyed, and left magic in Athas with tattered remnants of what once was.
Which Rajaat's followers and other Defilers tear apart with the casting of every spell.
But it should also be noted: Athas had Psionics -first-. It was only when the Pyreen formed, Rajaat among them, that Magic was discovered. The Age of Magic came after the Green Age. And it was his magic that made the sun turn from Yellow to Red.
At least... That's the story -I'd- tell, if I were the writers. But they'll probably go for the easier one:
See... Dark Sun is cut off from the rest of the Multiverse. Instead of all kinds of Transitive Planes and Outer Planes and so on and so forth, it only touches two surrounded by a third. The Grey and the Black within the Hollow. The Hollow is oblivion. It is nothingness. And it separates Athas from the rest of the Multiverse. Souls don't go to Arcadia or the Abyss or anywhere fun like that when they die. Spelljammers who try to get to Athas either get destroyed in the Hollow or miraculously make it through and become trapped.
Last edited:
Similar Threads
