D&D 5E 5e's new gender policy - is it attracting new players?

[hawkeyefan]

Indeed. My point was how much the quote said about general attitudes and why we have to keep having this argument.

Namely, we'll keep having this argument until people realize that "just a fighter" isn't a thing.

Sorry, but it is. It's a game. And people play it differently. In my game, I would say 90% of all the PCs have never had any romantic entangle mta whatsoever. It's simply not what interests my group.

If I was to fictionalize our game in a novel form, the first thin I would do would be to add those types of things in....because that's what people do, they find mates and fa in love and so on. But in a game, our characters don't need to be fully fleshed out individuals because what works for a game and for fiction are not always the same.

I have no doubt that if I asked my players "hey is so and so straight?" They'd say yes. However, it's simply never mattered to the game. The fighter is the guy in the armor on the front line, the wizard is the guy casting spells, the rogue is the skilled guy sneaking about. Those are the traits that matter.

I would never expect every game to be like this, and I can understand the appeal of a game quite different than this. But as I said above, no one's play style is wrong at their own table.

 

[Lanefan]

... perhaps it isn't a bad idea to toss a couple of LGBT bones in there as well.

At least, that's the argument as I see it.

If nothing else this'll get the Necromancers' Union on side.

Lanefan

p.s. this just gave me the most bizarre idea for how to start an adventuring party: you're the result of a Necromancer pulling some random bits up out of a graveyard, somehow raising them all at once, and seeing what he gets. The campaign starts with all of you standing in front of this guy, who then tells you you each owe him your life and now you're gonna go do him some work to pay it off; he gives you your group task (i.e. your first mission or two) and sends you off into the night...

 

[TheCosmicKid]

Namely, we'll keep having this argument until people realize that "just a fighter" isn't a thing.

In real life, no. In a game, it can be. What's the orientation of Gauntlet's fighter? He's not a gay fighter, and he's not a straight fighter; he really is just a fighter. No facts about him exist outside his proficiency at violence and hunger for food in the context of his dungeon-crawling adventure. You may say he's a shallow character, but here's the thing: he works. The game functions just fine. If you're looking for some mindless dungeony mayhem, Gauntlet has got you covered. And so does D&D, if that's what you want from it. You can build a three-dimensional character with family and romances, but your character sheet won't spontaneously combust or anything if you don't.

 

[Hussar]

Again though, no one should be telling anyone how to play the game. If your idea of dnd is Gauntlet then fair enough. Far be it from me to gain say that.

The real issue is in how the game, the published game I mean, is presented to the public. Just as we now add in some diversity in game books, extending that inclusion of diversity should not be an issue.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

In real life, no. In a game, it can be. What's the orientation of Gauntlet's fighter? He's not a gay fighter, and he's not a straight fighter; he really is just a fighter. No facts about him exist outside his proficiency at violence and hunger for food in the context of his dungeon-crawling adventure. You may say he's a shallow character, but here's the thing: he works. The game functions just fine. If you're looking for some mindless dungeony mayhem, Gauntlet has got you covered. And so does D&D, if that's what you want from it. You can build a three-dimensional character with family and romances, but your character sheet won't spontaneously combust or anything if you don't.

And let's be honest--it's not exactly uncommon in some circles to have a PC who doesn't even know his parents' names or whether he has any brothers or sisters. Much less having three-dimensional romances.

 

[hawkeyefan]

Again though, no one should be telling anyone how to play the game. If your idea of dnd is Gauntlet then fair enough. Far be it from me to gain say that.

The real issue is in how the game, the published game I mean, is presented to the public. Just as we now add in some diversity in game books, extending that inclusion of diversity should not be an issue.

I think the published game is pretty neutral in regards to these topics. I certainly don't see anything that would turn folks off of the game presented in the books themselves.

There are likely some preconceived notions about the game and those who play it that might act as a barrier to a potential player, but I don't think that there's anything about the published material that would do so.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Again though, no one should be telling anyone how to play the game. If your idea of dnd is Gauntlet then fair enough. Far be it from me to gain say that.

The real issue is in how the game, the published game I mean, is presented to the public. Just as we now add in some diversity in game books, extending that inclusion of diversity should not be an issue.

I wonder if the fact that some people default to 'everyone is white and straight until proven other wise' is part of the problem...

take some basic notes about an adventure in the town of Riverfork...

it's a large town that no PC has been to before. it's on the fork of the river. Most buildings are single story except for the two manors on either side of town, one owned by local banker other by lord mayor and family, and the bar in the center of town doubles as an inn.

the lord mayor ants to hire the PCs to stop attacks on land trade route, if you need stats use noble and give a ring of prot...if PCs take job the ring +200gp each is the reward

the bartender knows something is up because the alcohol that goes missing sometimes shows up in black marketif you need stats use the commoner but add 8hp

The head priest worships bahumut. use the priest from MM, but add the dragonborn race stats to it.

The general store owner is shifty and acts a little weird... sometimes black market goods show up here too, if you need to use the cult fanatic but swap out sacred flame cantrip for eldritch blast cantrip.

If you follow the road to look for the bandits you can find that the tracks from them split off half back to town and half to a hobgoblin camp.

the leader of the local thieves guild has a deal with the hobgoblins. the local thieves guild is made up of 3 spys, 6 thugs, 1 bandit captain, and a wererat. Give one of the spys a +1 weapon, one of the thugs +1 armor, and the bandit captain a cloak of cha 17 that plus a hand full of silver each is the treasure.

the hobgoblin camp is 14 hobgoblins, but half of them are out looking for a better spot for ambushes, and a few are sleeping at any given time. the lead hobgoblin has a Silver Scimitar of speed, and one of his fellow hobgoblins has a wand of magic missle. each one also has 1d8gp and 3d6sp on them. there 'war chest' at the camp also hold 10d6gp and 1d6 healing potions. at the camp they can also find a shipment of alchol, a ship ment of bolts of cloth and a strange book that may intrest the town priest....

that's more then enough info for anyone to take and run 4-6 hours of adventure... so no How many of the NPCs are white? what about straight or gay? how about just sex...is the mayor a guy, a girl, a trans, an other?

 

[Werebat]

It's been mentioned already, but basically, "men's rights activists" are kind of jerks. I could go into a whole bunch of details, but I don't want to derail this thread more than it already has. But google some of the stuff that the MRAs go into, and hopefully you'll see how they're a bunch of jerks.

I don't know which MRA's you've been exposed to, but the vast majority of the ones I've met have been unfortunate fathers like myself who really have been raked over the coals unjustly. I think I did watch one on Youtube once... Woman named Straughan? Karen Straughan. She didn't seem like a jerk to me. As I recall, she was exposing a feminist group called "Radfemhub" for being a hate group, and from what she was saying, they were indeed that thing. As in, talking about killing men in concentration camps and making soap out of their fat.

Ah, here it is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W46iTOiFm1U

She's a jerk? I think the people she's talking about are frightening, but she seems pretty OK to me.

But maybe you know of others I haven't seen. It's been a while since I've paid much attention, I've been busy raising my kids.

 

[seebs]

Sure, I agree. If we are speaking of a fighter where either the straight aspect is somehow more than a "default" sexual identity for the character. But because we all treat straight as the default,

And that's the problem, and why this text is good for the rules, and we need to stop doing that. Until people can accept that a "gay fighter" is no more of a big deal than a "straight fighter" who is not a "ladies' man" or whatever, we will keep having this conversation.

 

[hawkeyefan]

And that's the problem, and why this text is good for the rules, and we need to stop doing that. Until people can accept that a "gay fighter" is no more of a big deal than a "straight fighter" who is not a "ladies' man" or whatever, we will keep having this conversation.

I don't think it's a problem at most tables, though. i think of we were all seated at a table Playing D&D, none of these problems would really arise. Online discussions are something else.

Basically, for me, in a public game, anyone who continues to play the game or their character in some way that makes other players uncomfortable after they're made aware of it, is usually the person at fault.

If everyone's just nice to each other and respectful to each other...which has always been my experience in public games (which is admittedly limited to a few conventions over the years)...then things should be fine in most games and with most players.