D&D 5E A brief rant about Rime of the Frost Maiden, farming, logistics, and ecology

[Ancalagon]

... Who cares, it’s a story. Have the two years be the result of unreliable narrators, have the villagers did up winter stores, maybe there was a mass shipment of food by magic but that method was distrusted by one of the power groups in the region. Have people in one of the larger towns eat the flesh of the dead.

Who cares? Well if forever winter isn't a problem, when it's not a problem is it?

I care. It's jarring when things don't make any sense, it breaks immersion, and it challenges the PC's capacity to affect the world and react to events. The players can't make plans and are instead at the mercy of events determined by the GM based on dramatic need or whim.

In the real world, a drop of a few degree Celsius (due to volcanic eruptions) can lead to mass famine. Imagine an actual "no summer" situation... Thankfully the OP found a reasonable solution.

 

[Wasteland Knight]

I think maybe the

no, it’s just different priorities from what you prefer. Nothing to do with quality.

I am personally glad that they don’t worry about stuff like this.

I guess I prefer a modicum of common sense in my settings, but clearly I'm not the target audience.

 

[Wasteland Knight]

Who cares? Well if forever winter isn't a problem, when it's not a problem is it?

I care. It's jarring when things don't make any sense, it breaks immersion, and it challenges the PC's capacity to affect the world and react to events. The players can't make plans and are instead at the mercy of events determined by the GM based on dramatic need or whim.

In the real world, a drop of a few degree Celsius (due to volcanic eruptions) can lead to mass famine. Imagine an actual "no summer" situation... Thankfully the OP found a reasonable solution.

Yes. 2 years of winter would mean the PCs sitting all alone in the ruins of a tavern because everyone would have been gone or dead a long time ago.

 

[tolcreator]

Oh! I forgot to add the other change i was going to make: The setting mentions geothermal vents that keep the lakes from completely freezing. I'm also going to add that Bryn Shander is where it is, because there are major geothermal vents under it. These not only keep the houses warm, they provide hot water for bath houses and saunas, and maybe even keep the surrounding land a bit warmer and help with farming a bit.

 

[Charlaquin]

And another thing. Blizzards just make you lose your way. It is send by Auril herself. It is magically cold but $10 at the local Walmart and you don't have to save against the cold.
edit since @Charlaquin asks. I would suggest changing it. Be nice. Even with cold weather gear or cold resistance you MUST make the save. So a 6 hour blizzard could kill you.

I don’t recall asking anything...

On the subject of cold weather effects though, I rule that creatures with resistance to cold damage or cold weather clothing get advantage on their save but still have to make it. Creatures with immunity to cold damage or that are naturally adapted to cold climates succeed automatically. Same for extreme heat and fire damage resistance/immunity and weather-appropriate clothing or adaptation.

 

[TheSword]

The survivors of Uruguayan Air Force Flight 571 survived for 72 days in sub zero temperatures with next to no rations. I’m not saying it would be easy but that desperation can cause people to cling to life.

Hunger should be ever present in this campaign in my opinion.

What I’m saying is that calculating how many annual wagon loads of food is needed doesnt add much to the story. Or in fact the campaign, which is a snapshot of time.

In game of thrones winter can last 7 years... they save food What more do you need to know for it to be a good story.

 

[Wasteland Knight]

Oh! I forgot to add the other change i was going to make: The setting mentions geothermal vents that keep the lakes from completely freezing. I'm also going to add that Bryn Shander is where it is, because there are major geothermal vents under it. These not only keep the houses warm, they provide hot water for bath houses and saunas, and maybe even keep the surrounding land a bit warmer and help with farming a bit.

Good call. Since this is a fantasy setting, you could consider going a step further and have the settlement grow some sort of Underdarkish mushrooms in nearby caverns heated by geothermal vents,

 

[ninjayeti]

Yeah the whole "winters can last for years" bit is what turned me off to the Game of Thrones novels when they originally came out. Sure, civilized humans with highly developed agriculture could grow enough crops during long summers to survive a years long winter, but when all the plants die the herbivores are going to die off pretty quickly which means the carnivores are going to die off not long after that. Not to mention the problem of how agricultural civilizations ever arise when famine is going to wipe out humans long before they master farming. If a climate like that actually exited you would need to have an ecology adapted to survive those conditions not what is essentially medieval Europe just with wonky seasons.

So yeah, its lazy worldbuilding when a creator says "Here's a really cool idea. Now lets ignore all of the obvious ramifications of that idea and pretend everything else stays exactly the same."

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I guess I prefer a modicum of common sense in my settings, but clearly I'm not the target audience.

Probably you and I (and the designers it seems) disagree on what constitutes a modicum of common sense.

Not that common sense exists at all, of course.

 

[Wasteland Knight]

Yeah the whole "winters can last for years" bit is what turned me off to the Game of Thrones novels when they originally came out. Sure, civilized humans with highly developed agriculture could grow enough crops during long summers to survive a years long winter, but when all the plants die the herbivores are going to die off pretty quickly which means the carnivores are going to die off not long after that. Not to mention the problem of how agricultural civilizations ever arise when famine is going to wipe out humans long before they master farming. If a climate like that actually exited you would need to have an ecology adapted to survive those conditions not what is essentially medieval Europe just with wonky seasons.

So yeah, its lazy worldbuilding when a creator says "Here's a really cool idea. Now lets ignore all of the obvious ramifications of that idea and pretend everything else stays exactly the same."

Yes. It's not that I have a problem with "winters that last for YEARS!" as part of a setting.

But if that very extreme scenario is going to be a part of the setting, it's going to have a massive impact on the world.

You can't portray a setting is more or less "generic Medievaland" and then throw in a huge twist like "winter for years" without addressing this major factor. I don't expect a PhD level treatise on farming and economics, but some level of effort needs to be taken to provide a rationale for how civilization keeps going.