D&D 5E (2014) Aboleth entry in 5e Monster Manual

[Ragmon]

So...it REINCARNATES on the elemental plane of water...that would be funny. Random roll as per the reincarnate spell, *poof* drowning goblin on the elemental plane of water.

 

[Stormonu]

I think the reincarnate has merit. It's the "know everything every other aboleth knows" I have issue with.

In the bowels of the serpentine lair we found the aboleth Astragagar, and after protracted combat, we finally defeated it, though it cost at least three of our members.

As we exited the monstrous lair and wend our way back up through the cultist rooms above, Black Brian was obviously ruffled about the lack of treasure we'd found in the god-things lair. We humored him in rifling again through the cultist leader's chambers, but at first found nothing. In his anger, Black Brian dashed the bronze-and-serpentine idol left on a pedestal in the leader's chamber. Inside it we found an an odd key that looked like a swimming aboleth. After several additional minutes of searching, El'landon the hunter perceived the magically camouflaged secret door in the room, and we applied the key.

Beyond the doorway, we found a strange chamber, flecked with bits of serpentine gem. In the very center of the oval chamber was a slime-rimmed pool of greenish-blue water, which appeared to have no walls or bottom. Beside it was a brass pedestal upon which stood an ancient book. I still shudder at the words on the page it was open to...

"We beseech thee, dwellers of sunken R'lyeh - sons of Dagon, viziers of Cthulhu, kin of Olhydra - forget us not. Remember us and adore us as we hold open this portal to your darkest depths. In time when you call us to that sunken city, may we be reborn as thou art - undefeated, undeterred and hungry to return."

We must have burned a dozen spells collapsing the watery portal. Even as it screamed against our assault and the first ropy tentacles fought to keep it open, we could hear Astragagar call to our minds in a calm, fatherly voice - "This is not the only door to my house"

I only hope we will be paid enough for our deeds to bring back some of our dead, for truly, our fight is not yet ended.

 

[MonsterEnvy]

So...it REINCARNATES on the elemental plane of water...that would be funny. Random roll as per the reincarnate spell, *poof* drowning goblin on the elemental plane of water.

This joke was already made. It also does not reincarnates. Their spirit goes there and a new body forms for them after a bit.

They also only know what their parents memories they won't know what their siblings or any Aboleths they meet memories, and I doubt the get their parents memories of what happened after their birth.

 

[Ragmon]

This joke was already made. It also does not reincarnates. Their spirit goes there and a new body forms for them after a bit.

They also only know what their parents memories they won't know what their siblings or any Aboleths they meet memories, and I doubt the get their parents memories of what happened after their birth.

Well my face is red.

Yea, read its fluff.

They could have made it a bit more clear who are the parents and who are the offspring.
Do aboleths die of old age? If yes then normal offspring it is. If they are reborn like phoenixes, then offspring should be non-existent or very rare.
The re-forming on the water plane needs just a line or 2, to makes things completely clear for me.

 

[Li Shenron]

What the heck is this bull crap? First, how/why would the Aboleth's reincarnate? They don't believe in any deity. And why the plane of water? They are not water elementals or anything natural. They are aberrations! They aren't even fish! An aberration appearing on an elemental plane would draw the wrath of every elemental there.

Finally, the aboleth doesn't have any teleportation/plane shift abilities. How would it return to the prime material plane after reincarnation??

Can anyone make sense of this? Or is everyone just ignoring this new bit of lore?

I think I like the new bit of lore, and I am not going to make sense of this, because that's pretty much how nearly every sci-fi TV series gets spoiled. I'd rather enjoy seeing players like you torture themselves into trying to make sense of it, when there is no sense to make. And you know what? You think that by ignoring this bit of lore in your games will make the aboleth "problem" disappear, but it won't. It will always come back to haunt you... perhaps from the plane of water

I imagine the aboleth reincarnating is meant to be similar to demons and devils. But as the aboleth isn't extraplanar it is silly. And the plane of mention is even sillier.

I thought the same about a similarity with fiends not being truly dead unless killed on their home plane.

But the whole "extraplanar" thing was silly in 3e, i.e trying to shoehorn every monster carrying that label into functioning the same way. Especially since the same label was used for characters entering some sort of transformation at high level (e.g. some prestige classes) and for the temporary effects of spells. The reborn/reincarnate concept is essentially a narrative concept, and handling it with mechanical labels is the really silly thing.

I agree that the plane of water is not a brilliant narrative choice. This is my own guess/interpretation of the choice:

- they just didn't want the aboleths to reappear in the same place, and probably also thought that they needed a "special" place rather than reappearing at random in the material plane, therefore they had to pick another plane in the multiverse
- they could have picked abyss or hell, but perhaps they thought "oh, not again, let's think of something different"
- I am sure they considered the far realm, I don't know if maybe they thought it's not common enough (while OTOH almost every fantasy setting has elemental planes) or "too far" for the aboleth to come back

Actually I don't know if the MM says specifically where are the aboleths from... are they from the far realm, from the material plane, from somewhere else, or we just don't know?

Here's the deal: Not only is it not thematically appropriate (IME), it's unnecessary.

Every aboleth knows everything that every other aboleth knows, or ever has known. There's no need for a specific individual aboleth to come back, because the others are just going to go right on continuing the exact same plot.

Is this what the MM say about them, or is it just your own twist? This is totally fine, but I thought that their memory was not collective, just that each aboleth has perfect memory of itself + inherited memories from parent(s) + acquired memories from eaten victims.

So...it REINCARNATES on the elemental plane of water...that would be funny. Random roll as per the reincarnate spell, *poof* drowning goblin on the elemental plane of water.

Does it really say "reincarnate"? If this is the word used, then it's a poor choice, because by the concept they clearly just come back as aboleths, and "reincarnate" creates confusion with the spell, which is obviously not what happens to them.

 

[Mouseferatu]

Okay, my bad. I misremembered; it is "direct descent," not "every other aboleth."

But I think, in most of my campaigns, I'm still going to go with my mistaken interpretation over the "reborn in the Plane of Water" idea.

 

[MonsterEnvy]

Does it really say "reincarnate"? If this is the word used, then it's a poor choice, because by the concept they clearly just come back as aboleths, and "reincarnate" creates confusion with the spell, which is obviously not what happens to them.

It does not.

The aboleths' fall from poweris written in stark clarity on their flawless memories,
for aboleths never truly die. If an aboleth's body is
destroyed, its spirit returns to the Elemental Plane
of Water, where a new body coalesces for it over
days or months.

Okay, my bad. I misremembered; it is "direct descent," not "every other aboleth."

But I think, in most of my campaigns, I'm still going to go with my mistaken interpretation over the "reborn in the Plane of Water" idea.

Why it just makes them a Hive Mind which the Aboleths are not one nor were they ever intended to be.

I remember a cool little tidbit about what Aboleths do when they meet each other from Lords of Madness. They go back through their own racial memories until they figure out how they are related to each other. Aboleths like it when they are more closely related to each other then not, as they would share a lot of the same memories and have a better idea of the others motives and personality.

 

[Viking Bastard]

Put me down for "Meh." on the reincarnation bit, but I like a variation of the 'genetic memory'--when an Aboleth is defeated, it's memories get transmitted to all Aboleths in range (which is possibly *all* Aboleths), so the race will learn from it's individual members' failures. Until death, an individual Aboleth's memories are it's own.

Or maybe the genetic memory works both ways and when you kill one, you can expects it's mother to seek revenge, knowing exactly how it's baby died.

Zak Smith's hack of the 5e Aboleth was appropriately creepy.

I read it the other day and loved it. First time I've been inspired to use Aboleths. "Drawn to scale" is what did it for me.

It wasn't until well into the 4e era I realized Aboleths were popular. Or that they were supposed to be Lovecraftian in feel.

"Psychic Whale Wants Your Brain."

 

[occam]

I did not notice that bit. I was more put off by the illustration of the aboleth, which is not as good as any prior rendition of the monster in any edition of the game. In my opinion.

Agreed. There are many great illustrations in the MM -- actually, I like the aboleth illustration all right, it's just that it looks like some aboleth creation rather than an actual aboleth.

 

[Mouseferatu]

Sudden thought:

Suppose one of the eons-old aboleth schemes is that they will spread out enough so that, if you were to combine them, you'd know basically all there is to know--and then to "breed back down" until they produce one "super-aboleth" who really does have the memories of the entire race, since they're basically all in his--well, its--ancestry. And it is this aboleth messiah who they believe will be the key to overthrowing the gods.