AD&D: There and Back Again - a Role-Player's Tale

[lumin]

Still can't see it. There might be the same disclaimer, but since the 3E rules cover so much more territory than the AD&D rules, it comes up far less often.

Then show me a DC table that is in both 1E and 3E where 3E is more strict. I've shown that both the "pick pocket" and the "pick lock" tables were more strict in 1E.

 

[IronWolf]

So the rules state that the DC for opening a lock "varies". In AD&D, the DC for opening a lock does NOT vary.

Well - the type of lock varies. The DC for opening lock of said type is the same.

 

[Fifth Element]

1E is much, much stricter, as I have shown above.

You haven't shown it. You've claimed that 3E does not provide hard DCs for DMs to use in skill resolution. This is plainly untrue. If you're resting your case with your claim that all 3E DCs are simply free-wheeled, you're not going to convince anyone who has any experience with the game.

 

[ExploderWizard]

No, I have not backed away from it because every situation that could arise NOT within a table would be disallowed by the DM. So, yes, AD&D covers EVERY situation imaginable even if that means that many were a "no" from the Game Master.

How much AD&D have you played, and who are your poor players?

 

[Fifth Element]

Then show me a DC table that is in both 1E and 3E where 3E is more strict. I've shown that both the "pick pocket" and the "pick lock" tables were more strict in 1E.

In AD&D, the percentage chance to Pick Pockets goes down by 5% for each level of the target above 3rd. So the DC varies based on the level of the target.

In 3E, it's DC 20, as demonstrated above.

 

[lumin]

You haven't shown it. You've claimed that 3E does not provide hard DCs for DMs to use in skill resolution. This is plainly untrue. If you're resting your case with your claim that all 3E DCs are simply free-wheeled, you're not going to convince anyone who has any experience with the game.

Then prove it to me. Show me a DC table that exists in both 3E and 1E where the 3E table is less ambiguous and more strict than the corresponding 1E table .

 

[Fifth Element]

Then prove it to me. Show me a DC table that exists in both 3E and 1E where the 3E table is less ambiguous and more strict than the corresponding 1E table .

This is trivially done by using any 3E skill that does not correspond to a thief skill in AD&D. Handle Animal, for example.

 

[lumin]

In AD&D, the percentage chance to Pick Pockets goes down by 5% for each level of the target above 3rd. So the DC varies based on the level of the target.

In 3E, it's DC 20, as demonstrated above.

The DC 20 roll only applies to "a small object" and "a person". 3E is heavily variable depending on the situation (object size, person, beast, monster, spot check, etc).

In 1E the 5% applies to everything under EVERY circumstance at your level.

 

[lumin]

This is trivially done by using any 3E skill that does not correspond to a thief skill in AD&D. Handle Animal, for example.

Post the table in 1E and post the table in 3E side by side if they both exist. Let us judge for ourselves.

 

[Fifth Element]

The DC 20 roll only applies to "a small object" and "a person". 3E is heavily variable depending on the situation (object size, person, beast, monster, spot check, etc).

In 1E the 5% applies to everything under EVERY circumstance at your level.

Wait, so are you saying that in AD&D you could pick LARGE objects from a person's pocket? Of course it only applies to small objects, since those are the only types of objects that a person can have on their person, if you follow me.

Picking pockets (or folds of a garment or a girdle) also includes such activities as pilfering and filching small items. It is done by light touch and sleight of hand.

Note the reference to small items.