Age of Heroes - LR Gestalt Game (Roll Call)

[gabrion]

Gabrion, why did you take Divine Shield when you can't use a shield without losing your Monk bonus to AC?

Well I forgot to add it to the character's items (and thx for reminding me), but he'll be using a ring of force shield to gain a shield bonus to AC, which will let him benefit from the effect of divine shield. The item description says:

An iron band, this simple ring generates a shield-sized (and shield-shaped) wall of force that stays with the ring and can be wielded by the wearer as if it were a heavy shield (+2 AC). This special creation has no armor check penalty or arcane spell failure chance since it is weightless and encumbrance-free. It can be activated and deactivated at will as a free action.

Now if one focuses on the first part, which includes "can be wielded by the wearer as if it were a heavy shield," it might seem that this would remove monk benefits such as AC, fast movement, etc. However, the next line makes it pretty clear that this is no kind of encumbrence for the character. Combining that with the "as if it were" line makes me think that a monk can use this item without penalty and furthermore, a monk palading can use this fine along with divine shield. This is obviously a DM call though, so LR's input would be wonderful.

 

[Ferrix]

Well I forgot to add it to the character's items (and thx for reminding me), but he'll be using a ring of force shield to gain a shield bonus to AC, which will let him benefit from the effect of divine shield. The item description says:

Now if one focuses on the first part, which includes "can be wielded by the wearer as if it were a heavy shield," it might seem that this would remove monk benefits such as AC, fast movement, etc. However, the next line makes it pretty clear that this is no kind of encumbrence for the character. Combining that with the "as if it were" line makes me think that a monk can use this item without penalty and furthermore, a monk palading can use this fine along with divine shield. This is obviously a DM call though, so LR's input would be wonderful.

However, because it is considered a heavy shield, it negates the monk bonus to AC, regardless of whether it inflicts encumbrance penalties or not.

AC Bonus (Ex)

When unarmored and unencumbered, the monk adds her Wisdom bonus (if any) to her AC. In addition, a monk gains a +1 bonus to AC at 5th level. This bonus increases by 1 for every five monk levels thereafter (+2 at 10th, +3 at 15th, and +4 at 20th level).

These bonuses to AC apply even against touch attacks or when the monk is flat-footed. She loses these bonuses when she is immobilized or helpless, when she wears any armor, when she carries a shield, or when she carries a medium or heavy load.

It says nothing about the shield or armor having to inflict any sort of encumbrance penalty for her to lose the bonus, only that she carries a shield. Because the ring says that the shield can be wielded as a heavy shield it looks pretty clear that it's basically equivalent to a heavy shield made of force sans armor check penalties or arcane spell failure. You have to carry something to wield it.

 

[gabrion]

However, because it is considered a heavy shield, it negates the monk bonus to AC, regardless of whether it inflicts encumbrance penalties or not.



It says nothing about the shield or armor having to inflict any sort of encumbrance penalty for her to lose the bonus, only that she carries a shield. Because the ring says that the shield can be wielded as a heavy shield it looks pretty clear that it's basically equivalent to a heavy shield made of force sans armor check penalties or arcane spell failure. You have to carry something to wield it.

We'll I'll admit that I'm on shaky ground here, which is why I said I would need a DM ruling on this. If the DM thinks that the reason monks can't use shield/armor without loosing their AC bonus is realted to encumbrance, then it would make sense to allow them to use an item like this. If it's more metaphysical than that, then I suppose it won't work.

I'm glad you gave the response you did though, because I was missing something very important about the monk AC bonus. It doesn't say that using a shield is causes them to lose the bonus, but that carrying a shield does. With this in mind, it seems that an animated shield would work nicely to solve my problem.

 

[Ferrix]

It really should just read "uses a shield" to get rid of any confusion of whether it has to be carried, wielded, worn, etc. and to clear up funny loopholes like an animated shield or the force shield ring.

 

[Ferrix]

Still trying to figure out what to do with my character as gabrions basically fills most of his niche.

 

[gabrion]

Still trying to figure out what to do with my character as gabrions basically fills most of his niche.

Well keep in mind that Aramel is made to be a defensive aggro type character, so if you have a mind to make a paladin/knight type that's more offensive in nature, there is definately room for something like that.

 

[Question]

Im already in the offensive melee role though.

 

[Rhun]

I've got the arcane caster portion covered, or at least I will if I can finish tweaking the character I designed for Lord Wyrm's game that never got started...

 

[Velmont]

Wow, miss the thread for a good while. I had submitted my Monk/Psychic Warrior before the crash. If there is still a place, I am willing to join again. It can be with my Monk/Psychic Warrior or with another character if there is some missing talent in the group. If my poor Spot roll in the Talking the Talk thread have made lost my place, well, maybe another time.

 

[Shayuri]

I definitely want to try the Beguiler class from PHBII...the question is what to gestalt it with.

Things I've considered:

Rogue: Complements skill monkeyish nature, sneak attack will stack with the Cloaked Casting. Both can wear Light armor with no penalty. But kind of...bland. Of course, adding in a PrC, like Shadowdancer, helps combat that.

Monk: Great powers, but one of the advantages of Beguilers is that they cast spells in armor...which monks can't wear.

Duskblade: This one is tempting. A whole BUNCH of spells per day, all of which can be cast in armor, spontaneously, using Int as a spellcasting stat. Plus, the melee power of Duskblade helps offset the fact that the Beguiler's feinting power can only be used in melee. And Spell Channeling could be used in concert with Cloaked Casting to deliver quite a wallop.

...

I'm also considering one of the Shadow mage classes from Tome of Magic...they seem to fit the mindset.

Anyone else have thoughts on what class might complement a Beguiler gestalt?