Age of Worms H/C - unlikely :(

[Olaf the Stout]

For me, I'd only buy it as a hardcover because I'm both a bibliophile (I am super anal-retentive about how my gaming books are handled) and a practical hobbysist (i.e., I try to use what I buy in actual games if at all possible).

The problem with the magazines for me is that actually using them tends to make them fall apart rather quickly, even if handled carefully (transporting them to game seems to eat them up quicker than anything else, really). And that kicks my obsession with product preservation into high gear.

I don't have this problem with throwaway adventures, oddly -- most of the stuff I've seen in Dragon and Dungeon is so mediocre that if an issue burns up after a few game sessions, I could care less. The AP adventures are an exception, as are some adventures from Dragons of old (e.g., Barnacus: City in Peril).

Basically, my practicality conflicts with my desire to maintain my gaming material in pristine condition. Hardcovers wear much better for me (I can use a hardcover for years and it will still look brand new at the end of that time period, typically). This is especially true since I gave up smoking (no more yellow finger stains on the edges of non-gloss paper).

Now, back in the day (read "when I had a good job and money to burn") I simply bought three copies of every game product that I owned -- a player copy, a GM copy, and an archival copy. In recent years, I've started backing up the products that I own in PDF format and printing a copy for use, while putting the physical product up on a shelf*.

So. . . the fact that there will be no AoW hardcover saddens me greatly, as I'll likely never get to see the whole thing Damn my obsessions and compulsions.

*Before anybody gets all hot and bothered, this use of PDFs is covered under Fair Use.

If I got hot and bothered about anything in that statement James it would be the fact that you put the physical product up on a shelf and don't use it!

Still, each to his own, as they say.

Olaf the Stout

 

[Olaf the Stout]

I could live with it if I felt WOTC was putting out "quality" adventures. But honestly, has anything they've produced been anywhere near the quality of Shackled City, or AOW?

It's almost like WOTC saying: "Your stuff is better than ours, so we're taking our ball and going home!"

Instead, they should be hiring the writers from Dungeon to write their modules. After all, isn't Wizards all about the freelancer now?

Good to see you round here Darkfather!

(I assume that it is you from the maxminis boards)

Olaf the Stout

 

[DragonTurtle]

I can see the headlines: "Renton, Kent, Auburn Bombed! Massive Cloud of Methaphetamine Smoke Blows South, Tacoma, Lakewood and Spanaway Rejoices, Stays Up for a Whole Week."

Thank you! I'll be here all month!

Well crap :\ there goes my idea for opening up a meth lab.

On the other hand, I guess now is as good as a time as any to move to Tacoma.

 

[WhatGravitas]

Merric,

In the other hand, comic book publishers have been milking money from monthly magazines compilations for years. They reach customers like me who don't buy magazines (comics or gaming ones) but purchase compilations. Even better, I know quite a few that buy monthly titles and a few compilations of their favorite stories latter. Hardbacks reach a different market and, thus, only increase Paizo profits from their efforts.

Ron

Ditto. Personally, I like the APs, but I'm buying my Dungeons on "how much do I like it after leaving through"-basis. And while the APs are nice, I can't be bothered by them, when I'm leaving through - why? They're too scattered to catch my interest. I just cannot justify buying a magazine with an incomplete adventure (granted, the AP modules work standalone... but... you know).

And I'm too impatient to crawl from magazine to magazine. And I want to know about the end, when I start to plan a new campaign... and therefore the APs are nice to see, but as a selling point for Dungeon? They're... a bit wonky.

Disclaimer: I'm in Europe, so I cannot get the US subscription price. And I'm in university, so money is not that available - a hard cover is just easier and more handy because of these reasons.

 

[Dire Bare]

I don't know . . . if they make an Age of Worms hardcover, then they'd have to follow that up with a Savage Tide hardcover . . .

Collecting all the Savage Tide modules, the Savage Tidings articles in Dragon, the Player's Guide to the Savage Tide, all the web material, and the inevitable extra stuff that creeps into a hardcover compilation . . . do they make books that big?!?!?! It'd be bigger than Ptolus! (maybe)

 

[Nightfall]

I only ask for a smoke signal or something before the assault on Renton begins. Since that's where I happen to live, for good or for ill...

You have my assurances James, neither you nor any family member of yours will be harmed.

Erik,

if you have another target, just let me know. I feel the need for air raids.

 

[Erik Mona]

With only the Shackled City AP to use as a yard stick, do you have a figures to back this statement up? Did Shackled City bomb?

It far from bombed. It sold well into its second printing, and is continuing to sell.

Also, subscriptions have increased almost every single month since the relaunch in #114, and the numbers continue to grow. We are really happy with the subscription numbers for Dungeon. Would they have been even higher without the prospect of a hardcover? Maybe, but I'm not complaining.

By virtually any metric, the post-relaunch Dungeon has been the huge success story of Paizo, and represents a real phenomenon.

People are attracted to quality and D&D nostalgia. Who knew?

Oh yeah, that's right.

I did.

--Erik

 

[Nlogue]

Erik, you are a madman genius!

The proof already exists in the juggernaut of gaming excellence Paizo has become under your steady leadership, but I have personal experience bathing in the glory of your publishing puissance. I have had a total of three meetings with Erik about the gaming bizness, how did I get so lucky...well it's simple, I bribed him with dark chocolate macadamia nuts...anyhoo, the sheer tonage of gaming knowledge and publishing know-how he dropped on me, casually like he was mumbling simple arithmatic, stunned me in my tracks. Erik knows gaming, he knows gamers, and he is really dedicated to improving the first and satisfying the second.

Erik is a master of nostalgia and Greyhawk-ed-ness, but wears no blinders about possible ways to innovate and create quality products that are at once classic and excitingly new. I am a "young" game designer with no Greyhawk chops (I know, I should really just be killed), but Erik has done nothing but encourage, guide and support me as a freelancer, constantly giving me nourishing feedback that makes me a better writer with every project I work on.

Thanks for giving the gaming community a steady influx of amazing products, and for helpinging bring D&D into its second golden age Erik. I know I speak for a lot of people when I say - You're a god of gaming.

Nick

 

[Glyfair]

In the other hand, comic book publishers have been milking money from monthly magazines compilations for years. They reach customers like me who don't buy magazines (comics or gaming ones) but purchase compilations. Even better, I know quite a few that buy monthly titles and a few compilations of their favorite stories latter. Hardbacks reach a different market and, thus, only increase Paizo profits from their efforts.

However, there are signs that comic compilations are eating into monthly magazine sales. In fact, it was just announced that comic collections are outselling comics right now (i.e. the total sales of all compilations is higher than sales of all comic books).

This isn't necessarily a bad thing from a business sense, though.

Now, I may be atypical, but I find *most* of the value of the Dungeon magazine lies in the AP adventures. The other adventures may or may not be of use to me, but - as someone who is interested in the AP (and that fits the profile of anyone waiting for the AOW hardcover) - mostly they're of secondary value.

I don't think you are completely atypical. I think I am, though, I find the AP takes away my appreciation of Dungeon. I like the APs, but feel their success has turned Dungeon magazine into "Adventure Path magazine."

APs are of very limited use to me. I doubt I will ever have a campaign run from 1st to 20th level. That means to use the AP as anything other than inspiration (which I can get from a fantasy novel) or statblocks it will either feel incomplete or will require major work to file off the subplots. I have other resources that are better for those roles.

That means that about 1/3 of each issue with the AP is automatically going to be not used. The rest of the magazine then gets the normal odds of my using it. That devalues the magazine significantly. When Paizo runs another series (say a 3 adventure arc) I have to hope that's useful to me, or else most of the magazine for several issues becomes wasted.

Plus, the APs have dominated the magazine. "Shattered City," during its run, didn't dominate the magazine. It skipped issues and there were plenty of normal issues (without APs) between. "Age of Worms" ran in sequence, which I do think is the best method. However, there were very few issues between the end of "Age of Worms" and "Savage Tide." One ended and your were almost immediately immersed in another. Good for AP fans, bad for non-fans and maybe for those who become burnt out on APs (how many level 1-20 campaigns can you run?)

I like the idea of the APs, and the attention they gain Dungeon, but I want more space for non-APs. Give me an AP and take a year off before the next.

In fact, an "Age of Worms" hardcover might be favored from me in that the attention required might cause Paizo to give me the breathing space I desire.

 

[meomwt]

War of the Burning Seattle

I didn't dream when I started this thread that we'd be planning an assault on Renton in retaliation.