D&D 5E Alphastream - Why No RPG Company Truly Competes with Wizards of the Coast

[Morrus]

The stats have been phrased in different ways at different times:

• fans
• players in US/CA
• players ever

You'd have to check which they are using at a given time. At least one time somebody (was it the previous CEO? I don't recall) said that fans means 'people who have interacted with the brand', which is obviously a much broader grouping than people who have played D&D, which again is broader than people who currently play D&D.

 

[Charlaquin]

Has there ever really been a time when D&D was not at (or near) the top of the RPG pile? It has been the gateway to nearly everyone who has ever dabbled, ventured, or committed themselves to the one true king-daddy of all roleplaying games. Aside from some keen insights and interesting factoids, this article (and many others like it) are no-brainers.

But let's continue to be awed and amazed at the nearly 50-year run at the top of the industry. I mean, I'm still playing the game; just not the current edition.

It has always been top-dog, but there have been times when the competition was much closer. I think mainly during the peak of World of Darkness’ popularity and the height of the 3e/4e edition war.

 

[Alphastream]

Even Paizo with Pathfinder did not disparage D&D from what I saw (some of their players did during 4e's time, but I don't recall Paizo doing that).

Uhhh... I'm going to strongly disagree. I have friends who have and do work at Paizo and I love them dearly and always wish them well. But Paizo as a company was strongly into disparaging D&D and profiting off of the edition wars. They did so at the top level of the game/edition, but they also did so at an individual level when it came to employees and freelancers. I have numerous accounts of this, which I can't share. Paizo worked hard to make their success on the backs of edition wars and they threw people under the bus to get there.

 

[Oofta]

Please don't stop! I'm enjoying this discussion. I'm a fan of D&D and of other RPGs and this subject is a lot of fun for me. I think many of you are thinking along the lines I am when it comes to part two. (I'm finishing it up and should have it up early next week.)

So what you're really saying is that you don't have a good idea either and it was all just a tease!

EDIT: P.S. I kid. I'm looking forward to the article, it's always interesting to hear other people's perspective on things.

 

[Azzy]

Also not an unreasonable view, if you take the long and high view.

Though it is based on an assumption that non-trivial numbers of people come in through D&D and don't remain, for one reason or another, effectively "trapped" there these days. One thing I've noticed in the last decade is there's many more people playing D&D who are only aware of other RPGs vaguely if that compared to what I saw in the 70's and 80's, which seems strangely counter-intuitive.

Other companies don't need players to leave D&D for their products, though. Many of us are content to play multiple different RPGs as each scratch a different itch. Say, for example, Cyberpunk Red is doing well because it fills a different niche and genre than D&D. I love D&D, but if it were the only game I played I would get burned out on it—so I have other options like Cyberpunk Red, Mekton Zeta, Call of Cthulhu, WEG's Star Wars, Champions, etc. to spice it up so to speak.

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

How about D&Ds success has led directly to the Power Rangers RPG becoming a reality?

I don't know about that one, but there are quite a few successful 5E OGL systems and settings that would never have existed otherwise. Just think about Adventures in Middle-Earth, the OGL rules version of The One Ring. Both are very good, but AiME is much more accessible and sold way better than TOR.

 

[darjr]

I don't know about that one, but there are quite a few successful 5E OGL systems and settings that would never have existed otherwise. Just think about Adventures in Middle-Earth, the OGL rules version of The One Ring. Both are very good, but AiME is much more accessible and sold way better than TOR.

I don't doubt it, but do you have any numbers or quotes? I'm greedy, I guess.

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

I don't doubt it, but do you have any numbers or quotes? I'm greedy, I guess.

All of that was lost when Cubicle 7 shut down their forums.

 

[teitan]

As I recall during the last year or so of 4E's publication history, when they had an unusually low number of books released, they slipped into 2nd behind Pathfinder.

Key there being... low number of books being sold and those were remnants and edition neutral. When they did come out it would spike D&D back up. It wasn't a really good barometric to say "Pathfinder outsold D&D" because we could say the same thing about Vampire during the bankruptcy period for TSR when NOTHING was coming out and nothing was being reprinted.

 

[teitan]

If CR decided to go back to say Pathfinder, or even jumped to something like Call of Cthulhu, its disciples would leave D&D in droves. WOTC knows how much CR is driving sales, and will do everything their power to keep Mercer and his crew happy.

I have never seen data on it, would be very interested how many current players picked up the game via CR, and were never exposed to a proper session at a table before jumping into the game. I have run into a few at my gaming cafe, and their view of D&D is radically different than that of players pre-CR.

They've done CoC, which is probably why they've had the upticks.