Alternate Charisma Uses

[RedShirtNo5]

One concept I've worked with is "attunement" of magic items. Basically, most interesting magic items (not potions, +1 swords, etc.) require a Charisma check to be attuned to you and work properly.

-RedShirt

 

[RedShirtNo5]

2/ You stay conscious up to negative Cha bonus, and die at negative (10 + Con bonus).

This idea is excellent. In fact, I would go further and simply do this to make sure that low Chr is penalized:

You stay conscious up to negative Cha bonus, and die at negative (10 + Chr modifier)

-RedShirt

 

[MadBlue]

Yes. Evil folks are looking for power, and being the toady to a powerful personality is a tried & true path to easy power. (Charisma = powerful personality.)

Yes. Slinky, shifty people are not the sort whom anyone wants to associate with.

Just another thought, toadies aren't necessarily evil, but they're usually "slinky, shifty" sorts, or at the very least, uncharismatic sycophants. How are they going to get the chance to toady up to anyone with the system you propose if low-Charisma types tend to get greeted with spits and kicks?

MadBlue

 

[MadBlue]

Charisma -4: Apathy. Inanimate object.
Charisma -3: Disregard. Livestock.
Charisma -2: Dominance. Pet.
Charisma -1: Condescension. Child.
Charisma +0: Empathy. Equal
Charisma +1: Deference. Aristocracy
Charisma +2: Deep respect. Local leader
Charisma +3: Awe. Celebrity
Charisma +4: Servility. Great ruler or holy man
Charisma +5: Devotion. Religious icon or emperor

Why would a Chaotic Evil NPC feel servility - or even equality - to anyone, unless it were out of fear? And why would a Good NPC feel the urge to dominate a low Charisma character for any reason whatsoever?

MadBlue

 

[S'mon]

A realistic benefit for Fighters would be let them make Intimidate rolls in melee combat as a free action, once per foe, if they succeed the enemy must make Will save or be either Shaken or Panicked.

 

[RedShirtNo5]

Another concept that I've seen is a flat-out XP penalty/bonus based on Chr (sort of like the old 10% bonus for high stats in 1E). Something like 2-3x the Chr modifier as a % bonus or penalty. This got rejected in our group - it provides too much of a benefit for paladins and sorcerers.

-RedShirt

 

[Afrodyte]

Why would a Chaotic Evil NPC feel servility - or even equality - to anyone, unless it were out of fear? And why would a Good NPC feel the urge to dominate a low Charisma character for any reason whatsoever?

The descriptions are not meant to detail motives, but to describe how a person's force of personality affects other people. The second part of the description describes how noticeable the character would be. A good character with Charisma 10 interacting with a Charisma 7 character would not dominate them in the sense of the spell, but treat them like a pet almost (see word after "Dominate"). You can still be nice to them, and even fit them within one's moral compass, but it is more difficult to see them as fellow people and as individuals. Since it is more difficult to see them as individuals, it is more difficult to treat them as such. And yes, I do believe that even good people can fail to show proper respect, and that even chaotic evil people can be polite.

A character's forceful personality could (but by no means necessarily would) overcome another person's basic tendencies. Even in extremely hostile social situations, a high Charisma keeps the hostiles from treating them like they would every other enemy, or at least from doing so without thinking twice about it (that is, unless the person who gives the orders have an even higher Charisma). Thus, instead of killing you right away, they may keep you alive to find out information (even if you don't have any) since you give the impression of being in charge.

 

[Kid Charlemagne]

One thing I use to make charisma more useful (and its never been a big issue in my games) is to allow a Charisma check in certain social situations. For example, if the PC's want to know if they've heard of a particular person in their town, I give them a Charisma check - the high charisma types are the ones who make contacts with people as a matter of course. Supposing there's an NPC they want to speak to within their social circle (a priest in their church, or a noble at the court) I give them a Charisma check - the better the check result, the better they know them.

 

[Plane Sailing]

Since 3e arrived I've used Cha to provide Will ST bonus. I didn't shift anything to Wis at that time, but it still didn't tend to be a dump stat - spot and listen were just too important to risk penalties on.

The one area I was wary of was Paladins, who effectively got double their Cha bonus on their will saves - but it didn't matter... it worked out fine in practice.

For my next campaign I'm likely to continue this practice but move Initiative to Wis (as a perception based thing) - although I admit to really liking Cyberzombies idea of initiative linked to Charisma.

Cheers

 

[GreatLemur]

For example, if the PC's want to know if they've heard of a particular person in their town, I give them a Charisma check - the high charisma types are the ones who make contacts with people as a matter of course.

That reminds me of something I was considering a while back, actually: making a Contacts "skill" (which, obviously, would be Charisma-based) that would describe who a character knows, rather than what they know. Players could buy ranks in Contacts (military), Contacts (academic), etc., and make skill checks to try to call in favors. Or, if that's too effective or plot-avoidant, they could make checks to see if they know someone who might be able to help, and then use roleplayed interaction, bribery, Diplomacy checks, Intimidate checks, etc. to try to get the favor they want out of that individual.

Kinda cool, but it's probably the sort of thing most people would rather handle strictly though roleplay and plot effects (i.e., you did a mission for the guild of merchants, so now you know and are liked by a few specific NPCs there, etc.).