Alternative: Girls (females) in D&D/ Roleplaying

[Krensky]

Some bad ideas are EVEN OLDER than 500 years.

Know what? They're still bad ideas.

So thou would have us abandon the singular you? It's far, far younger the the singular or epicene they. English morphs and changes with the times. Singular they is in common usage and has been for a long time. Like all pronouns it can be ambiguous or confusing when improperly used, but it can also be clear, concise, and elegant.

Objections to it are pure prescriptive grammar. Someone decided singular they was bad, but there's no actual syntactic or semiotic reason. English has always been liberaly prescribed (see the old chestnut about defending the purity of the language). The French Academy was a bad idea when it was formed, it still is, and a similar body in English would properly be laughed out of existance.

 

[pawsplay]

So thou wouldst have us abandon the singular you?

Fixed it for you.

 

[Nifft]

So thou wouldst have us abandon the singular you?

Fixed, and not particularly.

However, I don't mind "y'all" as a functional replacement for plural "you".

I'm not against change, I'm just against bad change.

Cheers, -- N

 

[pawsplay]

In your sentence, there's an ambiguity between the doctor and the nurse. In my example (assuming we are allowing singular "they"), the ambiguity has expanded to include everyone in the meeting, as well as the doctor (singular) and the head nurse (singular).

So what? How is that any worse?

Singular "they": it never helps.

Not true. Assuming the person being spoken to in this exampe is unfamiliar with the doctor and nurse in question, it removes gender. Unless you are talking about a specific gender-related work situation, I don't see how identifying the gender of either person does anything but introduce the potential for bias. That is in fact the whole point: to neutralize examples where gender would be a distraction, or worse, a needless insult.

 

[Krensky]

Fixed it for you.

No, you didn't. I was purpously using moden grammar with an obsolete word.

Thanks though.

 

[Nifft]

So what? How is that any worse?

Because 3 is more than 2.

Your sentence (using "she") had an ambiguity between two parties. My sentence (using optionally singular "they") had an ambiguity between three parties.

3 > 2.

Not true. Assuming the person being spoken to in this exampe is unfamiliar with the doctor and nurse in question, it removes gender. Unless you are talking about a specific gender-related work situation, I don't see how identifying the gender of either person does anything but introduce the potential for bias. That is in fact the whole point: to neutralize examples where gender would be a distraction, or worse, a needless insult.

Wait. Are you asserting that being referred to as 'she' can be insulting to females?

, -- N

 

[Krensky]

Fixed, and not particularly.

However, I don't mind "y'all" as a functional replacement for plural "you".

I'm not against change, I'm just against bad change.

You haven't show why it's bad, other then it was confusing in a sentance where any pronuon was confusing.

Singular they has been used since the 1300s. Overly strict grammaticians have been Quixoctically complaining about the whole time with no effect on usage.

Your argumnt also ignores that the typical use in a game is a distributive case, "When a character is hit they take damage."

 

[Aus_Snow]

Nifft, while it's obvious you think you are right about this, that does not make it so. Learning the difference between belief and objective truth in this instance might be instructive for you.

I'll just go ahead and side with the many great writers and scholars with whom I happen to agree on this. Not to say many other great writers and scholars wouldn't agree with your stance, however! But anyway, you are of course free to believe what you will. Because, yeah, that's all it is. Might be better to simply accept that fact, and move on.

 

[Krensky]

Duplicate post, please delete.

 

[Nifft]

You haven't show why it's bad, other then it was confusing in a sentance where any pronuon was confusing.

In that example, I showed that singular "they" was more confusing than any alternatives.

If confusing = bad, then more confusing = more bad.

Singular they has been used since the 1300s. Overly strict grammaticians have been Quixoctically complaining about the whole time with no effect on usage.

Around that same time period they were also railing Quixotic against the Black Death. By now we've managed to handle that one. I'm sure that singular "they" is only slightly lower on The List.

Your argumnt also ignores that the typical use in a game is a distributive case, "When a character is hit they take damage."

That looks like a disagreement in number to me.

Cheers, -- N