Am I too cruel?

[I'm A Banana]

Well, it was bound to happen sooner or later.

My first complaint from a gamer: "You've given my character no reason to continue..."

To set it up...

The character was named Simon, eldest son and hated by his family. He lived in a barn in a tiny isolated villiage, while his younger brother got the inheritence, and his sister was planned for big things.

...the villiage was destroyed by his brother, who escaped

...his sister was sent away, to a southern town.

...upon reaching the southern town, he found his sister in the posession of a madman, who had turned her into a half-dragonflesh golem in an effort to "teach her to cast spells like dragons."

Was this too cruel?

In another campaign, I posessessed a PC with a demon that would not let them die...

To motivate her to be with the PC's, I made her mother actually a hag with a grudge against mankind...

Once the PC's killed her mom, I gave her a priest who wanted to help expell the demon from her...

Am I still too cruel?

I've been accused by my players of being a very cruel DM..."all history gets twisted into negativity!"......am I? These are perhaps the worst examples, and I don't really think they cross the line...

But I *did* make a player cry....(though she is, admittedly, the type to easily cry at movies or books or pretty much anything not real. )

Am I too bad?

 

[Terraism]

Well... if it's obvious that the players aren't enjoying struggles of that nature, then, yeah. I personally would say no, but that's judging from my perspective. I enjoy running my character's through Terrible Troubles and Tribulations (play on old wonderful module name), so I wouldn't mind too much... you did, I'm hoping, not force the possession of the PC, though. (As in, no chance to resist.) Also, as far as this newest PC goes... did you or the player decide that he was hated by his family?

 

[Gospog]

If you can evoke that kind of emotion from your players, you're probably doing something right.

Notice how they keep coming back.

 

[Terraism]

Grodog's got a good point; the Evil DM inside of me grins madly at the thought of making the players cry. The nice guy cringes.

 

[hong]

If your players are no longer having fun, then yes, you are too cruel.

 

[clark411]

A lot of it comes down to connectedness to the campaign. I've experienced DM's and players destroying character connections to the campaign world- heck, in one campaign we cringed when the DM asked us to write family histories because we knew he was going to readily swat them all- and he did. It is very easy to scythe through the foundations of a character's history simply to get at them. Doing it on occasion for plot is alright, especially where its a "Save your Sister!" type thing that highlights the fact that the players are playing heroes, rather than victims (which is what happens when PCs are suddenly fighting their undead / demon family).

Depending on the setting you are aiming for, players can rapidly find the entire world sort of caving in on them as the DM attempts to cause interesting mischief with them. Be it a fate-driven plot that requires them to save the world from ultimate destruction, or their families / neighbors / acquaintances dying and coming back to haunt them at every turn, many players find it a turn off to experience such bad events on a consistant basis. If everyone you hope to protect dies, and if everyone you meet becomes your enemy, and your family is now a tool to be used against you, and so on and so on, eventually a) your PCs are being overburdened development-wise by the world in which they exist (such as the hag plot or the demon possession plots you have used) or b) they go hermit or retire as they realize the best way to protect others is to have no others around them.

I'd spend half a session and ask what they want in a game, and also explain what you're aiming for yourself. If the point of the whole matter is to put them through hard times and have them rise gloriously from those trials, say so- and maybe they'll respond and enjoy the difficulties knowing it'll all work out for the best. However, if you wind up slicing it so that all you're doing is trying out mean tricks and slapping around their characters as justification for the obstacles they require to gain levels- then it's definitely time to reevaluate the sit'acion (unless they're S+M freaks who just truly like the pain of failure and dooooom heh). YMMV

 

[WayneLigon]

It sounds like you're too cruel, yes. I mean, good lord, if you actually made someone cry because of doing mean things to their character, that's terrible.

I have, actually, made a player cry but it was more tears of 'oh my, how sweet'. Her character was trying to find out from this NPC what she really loved about her deceased husband. The girl could not pick out any one trait, and finally said 'Does a miser love one coin above another? How then could I give account of my love in such a fashion?'. Then the player's eyes just brimmed up with tears and she had to excuse herself for a bit.

 

[DanMcS]

Have you noticed your players creating new characters with backgrounds like "I'm an only child and my parents died when I was 10"? Because if they write up backgrounds for their characters, and you consistently sieze upon them to cause the characters pain, they're going to start doing that.

You don't think you're going over the line, but the game isn't supposed to be fun for just you.

 

[ced1106]

Notice how they keep coming back.

Agreed!

I'll also note that many a GM complains about players who run roughshod over their campaign worlds. Two wrongs don't make a right, but sometimes I wonder how GMs can put up with what they go through, preparations or otherwise.


Cedric.
aka. Washu! ^O^

 

[Lord Zardoz]

Not really...

While you have done some intresting things with your players back stories, I must ask you, do you ever use the back stories for anything other then providing you with plot hook worthy monster fodder?

As others have mentioned, if you only use character back story as a means of providing targets for villians, then you need to work out some other options. This is especially true if these events happen the very FIRST time that you make use of the back story. Its only slightly better then inventing a brother that the player never thought of just so you can tell him that his characters brother has been murdered.

However, dont stop being cruel, just direct it a bit more plausibly.

I once had a session where the players came accross a particularly vicious goblin shaman that they had encountered before. Only this time, they came upon him, and the other goblins wiht him, as they were terrorizing a random farmer family. I told the players that each member of the family (Mother, Father, and some kids) were all tied to a post and on their knees amidst a pile of debris from their home. They also saw the goblin shaman gouge out the fathers eyes and eat them as the Mother and children were forced to watch.

Needless to say, the players charged in immediately to the rescue. And the goblin shamans first order in the fight was for his minions to put the family to the torch, and ignite the oil soaked kindling at their feet.

The result was that in addition to having players who were VERY motivated to act heroically, there was also a time limit on the fight (Can the brave heroes defeat the goblins before the family is killed by the fire?).

So, are you cruel? Yes.

Are you too cruel? No.

Are you too predictiably cruel? Yes.

END COMMUNICATION