Angel Finale
- Thread starter BrooklynKnight
- Start date
Green Knight
First Post
Notice the word "lying". She was lying to him, trying to comfort him, so she told him what he wanted to hear.
Eh, I've just about had enough of Xander and Willow. I hope we never see them again, save for the occasional guest appearance.
Do I NEED to go into my rant about how TNT completely sabotaged Crusade in every conceivable way?
Pielorinho
Iron Fist of Pelor
Wonderful finale! On the Bronze Beta messageboard (according to someone at yet a third messageboard), Joss posted the following:
Personally, I'm glad the show ended when it did: it was very sad to watch Buffy peter out instead of going out with a bang, whereas this show ended near the top of its form. Wesley's death was tragic, but c'mon, this is Joss we're talking about. He loves to hurt his characters. He's a rat bastard through and through.
Daniel
Joss Whedon said:Joss: Can't stay long. Wanted to say thank you one more time, to all of you except anyone who ever criticized anything ever at all. I came on these boards in Buffy's first year and the support -- and even the criticism -- has been more helpful than I can type. I set out in television with one simple goal: to purchase a russian bride. Didn't work out. Immigration stuff -- it's complicated. But I did get to make this show, and that other one, and that other other one, and meet some of the best artists and the best friends I've ever known.
I had dinner with Tim Minear the other night, and we talked about what kind of show we want to make next. And it always comes back to the same themes... people getting strength.
People helping out. People being thankful for whatever they have, be it power, a decent life, or a fun-tastic russian bride. And I'm thankful that for the last eight years my cohorts and I got to feel like the superheroes. 'Cause of y'all. I don't know if the Buffyverse is going to return to TV, but I hope so, and I know we'll be putting SOMETHING out there. Maybe on HBO, 'cause I like me some cussin'.
Keep you posted. <O
Personally, I'm glad the show ended when it did: it was very sad to watch Buffy peter out instead of going out with a bang, whereas this show ended near the top of its form. Wesley's death was tragic, but c'mon, this is Joss we're talking about. He loves to hurt his characters. He's a rat bastard through and through.
Daniel
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Jeremy
Explorer
Some of the little things I love that I want to highlight:
Lindsey and Angel
"Angel, the vampire with big brass testes."
Lindsey's swordplay.
Only got a glimpse of it, but in that moment it evinced better skill than I am used to seeing and I liked the touch.
Connor's confirmation.
That's the interpretation that I went with. He got his memories back, but because he didn't lose the fake memories or the happy childhood, he was able to appreciate the gift and the sacrifice.
Angel slamming his fist into the non-reactive Hamilton.
"Did that even hurt a little?"
He's so nice to make Angel feel better about himself before throwing him through the Wolfram and Hart sign.
Lorn getting back on the mic.
Spike getting back on the mic.
Gunn kicking more ass solo than human has a right to.
Lindsey's coming to honestly like being part of a team fighting the senior partners.
Lorn's very final ending of Lindsey and his explanation of it.
If you ask me, Angel didn't ask him to do it. Lorn decided to do it because while he understood Angel's choice to use evil to fight evil, on some level he didn't agree with it. And he sacrificed a little of his joy and a little of his soul to spare the world from what Lindsey would do if he got control of Wolfram and Hart.
***
I didn't see anything in the oncoming legion that looked like it could take Angel, Spike, and Illyria fighting together. I didn't see anything in there that looked like it could take Illyria solo. But Spike's very eloquent description of Gunn's condition and Illyria's point blank confirmation of him being dead in a few moments pretty much confirm for me that he's going down.
How aggravating to the senior partners is it going to be when their big plan to stifle Angel and Co pays off with the destruction of their most powerful servants (including a liason charged with their essence), and when they vent and send a legion after him, the remnants of a demon older than they aids in them destroying everything that was sent.
You'd think with all the power the Senior Partners had they could have at least armed their men with a few stakes. Beat on the Vamps all you like, it doesn't tend to kill them. 
Lindsey and Angel
"Angel, the vampire with big brass testes."
Lindsey's swordplay.
Only got a glimpse of it, but in that moment it evinced better skill than I am used to seeing and I liked the touch.
Connor's confirmation.
That's the interpretation that I went with. He got his memories back, but because he didn't lose the fake memories or the happy childhood, he was able to appreciate the gift and the sacrifice.
Angel slamming his fist into the non-reactive Hamilton.
"Did that even hurt a little?"
He's so nice to make Angel feel better about himself before throwing him through the Wolfram and Hart sign.
Lorn getting back on the mic.
Spike getting back on the mic.
Gunn kicking more ass solo than human has a right to.
Lindsey's coming to honestly like being part of a team fighting the senior partners.
Lorn's very final ending of Lindsey and his explanation of it.
If you ask me, Angel didn't ask him to do it. Lorn decided to do it because while he understood Angel's choice to use evil to fight evil, on some level he didn't agree with it. And he sacrificed a little of his joy and a little of his soul to spare the world from what Lindsey would do if he got control of Wolfram and Hart.
***
I didn't see anything in the oncoming legion that looked like it could take Angel, Spike, and Illyria fighting together. I didn't see anything in there that looked like it could take Illyria solo. But Spike's very eloquent description of Gunn's condition and Illyria's point blank confirmation of him being dead in a few moments pretty much confirm for me that he's going down.
How aggravating to the senior partners is it going to be when their big plan to stifle Angel and Co pays off with the destruction of their most powerful servants (including a liason charged with their essence), and when they vent and send a legion after him, the remnants of a demon older than they aids in them destroying everything that was sent.
You'd think with all the power the Senior Partners had they could have at least armed their men with a few stakes.
Beat on the Vamps all you like, it doesn't tend to kill them. 
Cthulhudrew
First Post
Jeremy pontificated:
I agree. At first I thought Angel asked him to do it, but the more I reflect, the more I think that Lorne and Lindsey were together because Angel knew Lorne couldn't handle the demons by himself, so he recruited Lindsey to protect his friend. To do so, he had to make a deal with Lindsey, and Lorne didn't want to do that sort of thing anymore. Like he said, "I've heard you sing." He knew that whatever Lindsey was feeling in the heat of the moment, Lorne had seen his soul before (and future) and knew he was evil.
Frankly, I think seeing and working with all the evil over the year must have been tougher for Lorne than anyone else. I mean, anytime someone started humming at W&H or singing or whatever, he'd see their true natures (everyone else would just hear singing). Must have been rough on the guy.
I was kind of surprised, though, because when I first heard that they were going to make some cast changes next season (when they were still thinking they'd get renewed) I immediately figured Lindsey would be becoming one of the team, and this episode sure seemed to be setting that up... until, "Blammo!"
I agree. At first I thought Angel asked him to do it, but the more I reflect, the more I think that Lorne and Lindsey were together because Angel knew Lorne couldn't handle the demons by himself, so he recruited Lindsey to protect his friend. To do so, he had to make a deal with Lindsey, and Lorne didn't want to do that sort of thing anymore. Like he said, "I've heard you sing." He knew that whatever Lindsey was feeling in the heat of the moment, Lorne had seen his soul before (and future) and knew he was evil.
Frankly, I think seeing and working with all the evil over the year must have been tougher for Lorne than anyone else. I mean, anytime someone started humming at W&H or singing or whatever, he'd see their true natures (everyone else would just hear singing). Must have been rough on the guy.
I was kind of surprised, though, because when I first heard that they were going to make some cast changes next season (when they were still thinking they'd get renewed) I immediately figured Lindsey would be becoming one of the team, and this episode sure seemed to be setting that up... until, "Blammo!"
Green Knight said:
Funny, I feel the same way about Spike...
As far as Xander and Willow, I'd like to see them the way they were in the first few years of Buffy (it'll never happen, I know, but...) I liked it when Xander and Willow were best friends, instead of just people who saw each other occasionally.
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Pielorinho
Iron Fist of Pelor
The idea that Lorn killed Lindsey on his own hadn't even occurred to me, but I really like it. It makes the scene even more painful.
Daniel
Daniel
RangerWickett
Legend
I want to take a poll. Who thinks they survived, and how much?
I personally think they all died, except perhaps Spike staggering away from the piles of bodies, having been knocked out and left for dead. I interpreted the giant faceless horde of dark monsters, including the giant dark shape in the background and the dragon in the sky, as being an unstoppable horde, and what we saw was just the first wave. The heroes would fight and try to stop as much evil as they could, because it was what's right to do, but none of them had any illusions about coming out of that alive.
That makes Gunn's mortal wound less depressing, more heroic. He'll fight even though he's horribly injured, because he wants to go down with his friends. They're all going to die, but Gunn, the human, has the strongest spirit of them all at the end.
But yeah, Angel gets to slay his dragon. And he'll do it with a smile, trying to make sure not to enjoy himself too much as he sticks it to the man, just in case he might get happy. You wouldn't like him when he's happy.
I personally think they all died, except perhaps Spike staggering away from the piles of bodies, having been knocked out and left for dead. I interpreted the giant faceless horde of dark monsters, including the giant dark shape in the background and the dragon in the sky, as being an unstoppable horde, and what we saw was just the first wave. The heroes would fight and try to stop as much evil as they could, because it was what's right to do, but none of them had any illusions about coming out of that alive.
That makes Gunn's mortal wound less depressing, more heroic. He'll fight even though he's horribly injured, because he wants to go down with his friends. They're all going to die, but Gunn, the human, has the strongest spirit of them all at the end.
But yeah, Angel gets to slay his dragon. And he'll do it with a smile, trying to make sure not to enjoy himself too much as he sticks it to the man, just in case he might get happy. You wouldn't like him when he's happy.
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