Anyone want to help adjudicate a Wish spell?

[Infiniti2000]

Has anyone answered this yet? I'd like to know also.

He's mistaken. When hit with poison, you must make both saves. Even if you fail the first one, you must make the second one. This was my point. The PCs knew for sure that they would have to do this one minute later and that it could be quite deadly. Having three PCs die from it is the price of their arrogance IMO (not in a bad way, mind you, if they were just roleplaying their characters like that).

 

[Goolpsy]

That wish is worded very well.. and they aren't asking for a whole lot... i suggest u either make the wish jump 6 sec back in time... and let everyone reroll their saves (yet still with the xp loss)

Or even let them succesfully make the save...
For all good sakes.. let there always be something "bad" with a wish liek the death god appearing.. questioning them where his bodies went..

Or some balor or other fun outsiders appearing cause of the extreme use of magic

 

[Three_Haligonians]

Are you playing 3.0?

Note that in 3.5, secondary damage is 3d4 Con (not death)

No...see.. it was a Half-Iron Golem.. from the MMII... and therefore.. its.. um.. listed as.. well..before errata its....


SON OF A..!



Thank-you for your suggestions.. they have been most helpful.

J from Three Haligonians

 

[Lord Pendragon]

If you allow the wish to grant three resurrections, not only are you breaking the rules on wishes...

Since the rules on wishes already include complete DM adjudication, it's impossible to "break the rules on wishes." The DM could grant a wish to become 100th-level from 1st and not be breaking any rules at all. The DM decides how far a wish can take you.

Several posters have made a good point about the "save" feature, though. I wouldn't want my PCs to be able to (or think they were able to) use a wish to undo negative effects.

My new advice is this: have the Wish roll back time to just before the PCs were hit with the golem's breath weapon. It breathes on them, and because of the wish they completely resist (don't have to make any sort of save) the attack. Then they will have to finish the fight on their own.

I'd also stress to the sorceress how she can feel the very fabric of reality stretching because of her wish, warping to accomodate the new timeline, and tell her that she gets the very strong feeling that another such wish to undo an event already transpired could have very dire consequences indeed.

Then I'd sic the Inevitable on her, to boot.

 

[Scion]

Seems reasonable to me. Considering the cost I wouldnt have anything bad happen.

If I was feeling especially mean then I would simply use it as either 3 castings of revivify (they did just die after all, getting a few castings of a low level spell doesnt seem that bad, especially with the price tag) or a weak version of time regression and have them all reroll their saves.

I dont see any need for any big baddies to show up, it was a fairly minor wish after all. The effect from the players point of view it looks big, but overall the effect was small (a couple of successful secondary saves on a poison, or a few revivifies, or an extra chance on the roll).

 

[Vlos]

He's mistaken. When hit with poison, you must make both saves. Even if you fail the first one, you must make the second one. This was my point. The PCs knew for sure that they would have to do this one minute later and that it could be quite deadly. Having three PCs die from it is the price of their arrogance IMO (not in a bad way, mind you, if they were just roleplaying their characters like that).

Yeah, I checked the SRD. I was wrong, they do require the second check even if they do make the first check.

from SRD
POISON

When a character takes damage from an attack with a poisoned weapon, touches an item smeared with contact poison, consumes poisoned food or drink, or is otherwise poisoned, he must make a Fortitude saving throw. If he fails, he takes the poison's initial damage (usually ability damage). Even if he succeeds, he typically faces more damage 1 minute later, which he can also avoid with a successful Fortitude saving throw

 

[Talmun]

<snip> I dont see any need for any big baddies to show up, it was a fairly minor wish after all. The effect from the players point of view it looks big, but overall the effect was small (a couple of successful secondary saves on a poison, or a few revivifies, or an extra chance on the roll).

The main reason I suggested the Marut was that its express purpose, the reason it exists, is to punish those who avoid death.* Note that it needn't be an outright opponent, just a consequence of using wish magic to turn back the forces of fate.

Interesting that you view using wish to bring three people back from the dead as a "small" effect. I take it that resurrection and wish magic is common-place in your games?

*As a side note, I realize that this should mean that the Marut (what is the plural for that?) would be very busy in the average high-level game, but all things, even the rules, must bow before fun and story. In the situation that the OP describes, having a Marut show up seems like a perfect way to let the players come back, but still have consequences for their actions.

 

[haakon1]

"I wish that [Character A], [Character B], and [Character C] had resisted the poison that just killed them."

I play Wish the old school, 1st Edition way, which is that it can do nearly anything, but anything that can go wrong, will go wrong, so you'd better lawyer up before casting it.

For example, I'd look for something like this:

"I wish that, all other things being as they are now, my friends A, B, and C are Raised from the dead to be in all ways as healthy as they were yesterday."

You could twist that too, of course, and I'd encourage you to try, but it's fun to do the wordsmithing on it.

I'd be inclined to say either:
1) OK (if the player isn't really up to doing any better, like the guy who used to roll d12's instead of d20's all the time)
2) Yes, they "resisted". They struggled valliantly, and perhaps had a "resistance" spell effect to help that gives a +1 or whatever to see if that would have pushed them into making it, and if not, they are still dead.
3) OK, yes, they HAD resisted, but boy, was that a long time ago. It's now 3 years later, in which X has happened in the campaign.

The last one was an idea I really wanted to use in a campaign. A very silly campaign, that started as Oriental Adventures, transformed into OA characters in Gamma World, had them crash land "Planet of the Apes" style in alternate Earth real world 1969 America, got them sent to Vietnam as truly Special Forces and then ... I was going to have an NPC team member find a Ring with One Wish left and wish:
"I wish we all make it through the war alive!"

Cut to the King Kamahamea Club, as in the "Magnum" Vietnam vets being detectives in late 1970s Hawaii, all having made it through the war alive.

Then of course, the President calls up America's most special special force to go rescue the hostages in Iran, since it's 1979 now instead of 1969 . . .

For crazy "light" campaigns like that, Wish is great DM fodder . . .

 

[Tatsukun]

Well I would raise them all. I like the logic that the Wish is replicating a "Raise Dead, Mass" Spell, which should be right around 9th level. The only problem is that Raise Dead is a Cleric only spell. Does this Sorceress happen to worship a god of magic? Maybe that's your source with there. Then again, there is no reason it has to be a god. Is the sorceress particularly devoted to an alignment, or a cause?

If no, then you could go with the plot hook method. Don’t make them fight an insanely big monster, but have it open up new opportunities to them (I like the lich mission).

But I wouldn't punish them too much. It seems very adversarial to just try to screw the party over every time the cast the spell. Wish should bring big problems to those who go wild and ask for the moon. Asking to cast "Raise Dead, Mass" doesn't seem too bad to me.

-Tatsu

 

[Tatsukun]

One more thing. Does anyone else find it odd that a 1/2 Iron Golem's breath weapon is much worse than a real Iron golem's?

1/2 Iron golem, 1/2 what? 1/2 Insane Death-Monkey?

-Tatsu