Archer Druid Subclass?

[Leatherhead]

Druids have so much going for them that it's hard to fit anything else in.

I recommend starting by making a new cantrip a la Magic Stone or Greenflame Blade. Then if that isn't enough archer for you, consider creating a custom subclass that converts Wildshape charges into archery bonuses.

 

[Guest 6801328]

Druids have so much going for them that it's hard to fit anything else in.

I recommend starting by making a new cantrip a la Magic Stone or Greenflame Blade. Then if that isn't enough archer for you, consider creating a custom subclass that converts Wildshape charges into archery bonuses.

Yeah, putting Wildshape in the base class really constrains things.

Also, to be clear, it's not that I'm trying to build this character for a new campaign or anything. I'm just wondering if there's enough meat behind the concept to warrant a sub-class. Just because it's fun to think about those things.

If every concept that could be approximated as a multi-class eliminated the need for that sub-class, we wouldn't have very many sub-classes left.

I guess what I'm really looking for is a broader concept than "druid with bow", but something that in turn rationalizes why these druids would favor using bows. And then how would that concept be instantiated as abilities.

By the way, I think it should include blowguns, too. Shortbow, Longbow, Sling, Blowgun.

 

[Cap'n Kobold]

The concept is sounding really like a Ranger.

Druids get full-casting progression and Wildshape as baseline: this leaves very little room for sub-class capabilities. You would be better off using a half-caster progression since that would allow you to have a decent martial capability that would be worth using rather than your spells but still be balanced.

The alternative would be a subclass, or even just a fluff change where a druid's spells were magical effects etc delivered by their arrows. But that would still be using their spells to fight rather than having martial attacks on-par with rangers for example.

 

[Guest 6801328]

The concept is sounding really like a Ranger.

Druids get full-casting progression and Wildshape as baseline: this leaves very little room for sub-class capabilities. You would be better off using a half-caster progression since that would allow you to have a decent martial capability that would be worth using rather than your spells but still be balanced.

While that is true, Warlocks and Wizards are also full caster classes and yet have martial subclasses (Bladesinger, Hexblade). So it can be done.

 

[Tales and Chronicles]

When making archery-based archetypes for players, I often start with a refluff of the gunsmith archtype for the UA artificer to allow different ''shot'' options rather than just tacking Extra-attack that players wont use much because spells will always come first.

Seeker (the 4e name for the archer-druid)

lvl 2 Armament of the Spirit
You gain prof. with Short Bows and Long Bows. You increase the range of every ranged or thrown weapons by your Wis score.

lvl 2: Elemental Spirits
As a bonus action, you can expend one use of Wildshape to bind your weapon to the elements of nature. For the duration of the wildshape, choose fire, cold, lightning or poison. As an action, you can make a special attack with a ranged or thrown weapon that deals an extra 1d6 damage of the chosen element on a hit. This extra damage increases by 1d6 when you reach certain levels in this class: 5th level (2d6), 7th level (3d6), 9th level (4d6), 11th level (5d6), 13th level (6d6), 15th level (7d6), 17th level (8d6), and 19th level (9d6).

lvl 6: Thorn Cloud Shot
As an action, you can make a special attack with your bow or thrown weapon. Rather than making an attack roll, you unleash force energy in a 15-foot cone from the weapon. Each creature in that area must make a Strength saving throw with a DC of 8 + your proficiency bonus + your Intelligence modifier. On a failed saving throw, a target takes 2d6 acid damage and is pushed 10 feet away from you. This damage increases by 1d6 when you reach certain levels in this class: 13th level (3d6) and 17th level (4d6).

lvl 10 Alicorn Lance
As an action, you can make a special attack with your bow or thrown weapon. Rather than making an attack roll, you cause the weapon to unleash a lance of radiance, 5-feet wide and 30-feet long. Each creature in that area must make Dexterity saving throws with a DC of 8 + your proficiency bonus + your Intelligence modifier. On a failed saving throw, a target takes 4d6 radiant damage. This damage increases to 6d6 when you reach 19th level in this class.

lvl 14 Tidal Wave shot
As an action, you can make a special attack with your bow or thrown weapon. Rather
than making an attack roll, you launch an missile imbued with the raging spirit of the primordial sea. The round
detonates in a 30-foot radius sphere at a point within range. Each creature in that area must
make a Dexterity saving throw with a DC of 8 + your proficiency bonus + your Intelligence
modifier. On a failed saving throw, a target takes 4d8 cold. damage

 

[Kobold Stew]

Back in the days of 3.5, there was a character class variant for the druid that I always liked (and once got to play). It's in the 3.5 SRD here.

Basically, you lose Wildshape, and gain the following:
(a) Bonus to Armor Class when unarmored (as monk, including Wisdom bonus to AC),
(b) fast movement (as monk),
(c) favored enemy (as ranger),
(d) swift tracker (as ranger),
(e) Track feat (as ranger).

Of these,
(a) corresponds to the 5e Monk's Unarmored Defense
(b) corresponds to the 5e Monk's Unarmored Movement
(c) is less than the 5e Ranger's Favored enemy (no damage bonus)
(d) and (e) share some features with the 5e Ranger's Natural Explorer.

I'm not especially concerned about the reduction in damage from (c), because Wildshape in 3.5 was closer to the Moon Druid's Wildshape, not the basic ability all 5e Druids get.

For me, the only question is whether something needs to be done to make up for the "reduction" in (d) and (e). If so, I suspect that proficiency or (if already proficient) Expertise in Survival would be enough.

I would also add proficiency in Shortbow (with some characters having longbow by other means), for your concept.

The character is still a primary spellcaster, and never gets 2 attacks/round, but could effectively use a bow and would be an awesome skirmisher character to play.

 

[TwoSix]

Considering druids get Wild Shape and their Circle simultaneously, maybe a feature to either drop Wild Shape or diminish it (say, never gain the chart increases to CR and mobility, and be limited to CR 1/2 for all levels) in exchange for martial abilities could be implemented.

 

[ClaytonCross]

- omitted and reduced for space-

Two obvious ideas are:
- Use Wisdom instead of Dex for bow/sling attacks (Shillelagh for ranged weapons)
- Divine Smite equivalent. Poison would be the most flavorful damage type, but so many creatures have resistance/immunity to Poison.

Any ideas for nifty abilities be that aren't just damage boosts?

Bonus spells list might include:
- Hunter's Mark

Thoughts?

So we already have Shillelagh, Devotion paladins with Sacred Weapon (works on bows), HexBlade warlocks using Charisma with improved pact weapon bows that eldritch smite at range. Hunter's mark is already duplicated from rangers to warlocks with hex. I am not against the idea but I feel like it NEEDS to be something unique not just another reskin and sharing of existing powers / spells. Otherwise your just playing a Arche Fey Patron Warlock pact of the Blade using a improved pact weapon and smiting at range... which again redundant.

To that end...

If your going to steel a bonus spell don't steal hunter's mark that relies on number of attacks when druids don't get extra attack or a way to attack with again with a bonus action. Some better spells to borrow would need to be focused on single attacks with special effects. Examples:

Ensnaring Strike - does not say melee attack, restrains targets for other allies to beat on, does damage every round, DAMAGE SCALES WITH SPELL SLOT USED!!
Zephyr Strike - does not say melee attack, allows the archer to break from melee range without granting an opportunity attack, which is good for an archer
Hail of Thorns - does AoE damage and damage scales with slot used.

The only issue here these are Ranger spells and druids have more and hire spell slots, so not only are you steeling them but you can use them more and with higher damage than a Ranger could dream for.... just these 3 would make a Ranger cry. We no longer need them.

lets consider the Green Flame Blade, Booming Blade, and Shadow Blade spells. All powerful melee spells that scale. You can stack the cantrips with Shadow Blade. A druid "arcane archer" does need a cantrip spell that scales because of the number of spell slots they get but that didn't stop them from giving all of these to a sorcerer (draconic get 13 + dex AC which is low level medium armor.)

The most interesting part of these to me is Shadow Blade and its damage progression:
Advantage to hit in dim light or darkness + respawn and other effects
Psychic damage
2d8 at level 2
then "At Higher Levels: When you cast this spell using a 3rd or 4th level slot, the damage is 3d8. At 5th or 6th level, it's 4d8. At 7th level or higher, it's 5d8."

Lets make that Nature based:

StormBow
2nd-level enchantment
Casting Time - 1 bonus action
Range - Self
Components - V S
Duration - Conc. Up to 1 minute
You touch a bow or crossbow imbuing it with natures power. You're proficient with it until the spell ends. It deals 2d8 Lighting damage. You have advantage if the target is wearing metal armor.

If you drop the weapon or throw it, while the spell lasts, you can use a bonus action to make the weapon dissipate and reappear in your hand.

At Higher Levels: When you cast this spell using a 3rd or 4th level slot, the damage is 3d8. At 5th or 6th level, it's 4d8. At 7th level or higher, it's 5d8.

But hay lets consider booming blade, because they gave it to melee already and that would be awesome with a ranged weapon

Thunder strike Arrow
Enchantment cantrip
Casting Time - 1 action
Range - self
Components - V M (A Ranged weapon)
Duration 1 round
Draw and arrow or bolt imbuing it with natures power then immediately make a ranged attack with an appropriate ranged weapon. On hit, the target suffers the attack's normal effects and if it willingly moves before the end of your next turn, it takes 1d4 thunder damage and the spell ends.

At 5th level, the melee attack deals an extra 1d4 thunder damage, and the moving damage increases to 2d4. Both damages increase by 1d4 at 11th and 17th level.

You will note that I changed the damage to a 1d4, but if we are honest this is in addition to your normal attack and your likely not in striking range of anyone you would use it on making it WAY more powerful than the standard booming blade for crowd control. Without play testing it reducing it to a d4 should make it an impact but not just striate murder melee enemies who will have to move to you to attack. Yes, you can use booming blade with a glaive for a similar effect but then you would not be combining it with shadow blade.

 

[Guest 6801328]

Oh, here's an idea...a RANGER sub-class that:
- Learns Shillelagh and Druidcraft as cantrips.
- Gets access to the Druid spell list, maybe with some bonus spells known.
- Can use Wisdom instead of Dex when attacking with a bow.

 

[Dausuul]

Balance-wise, the problem with making a bow effective for a druid is that druids are also full casters, so their at-will attacks (cantrips and Wild Shape) must be weaker to compensate.

So, probably what I would do would be to design a druid circle that lets you burn spell slots for bonus damage with your bow attacks, somewhat like the paladin's Smite ability. That way you aren't competing with the martials on at-will attacks, but you still have a compelling reason to use the bow.