D&D 5E Aren't Short Rest classes *better* in "story-based" games rather than dungeon crawls?

[Li Shenron]

Short Rests are meant to recuperate some expended resources, not all. Some classes (Warlock) recuperate more than others but are supposed also to run out more quickly between short rests. Things are meant to even out on a long run due to the variety of adventures. If you constantly run adventures that are significantly paced faster or slower than average, or have limited variety, then it's time to look into dialing short & long rests durations.

I do not allow the PCs to stack short rests to recuperate more. One hour or more is still a single short rest. If you really need more, take a long rest.

I also don't allow shenanigans such as taking some useless strenuous activities to say a short rest is over and another can be started: just like as a DM I do not cheat my players into trying to regularly interrupt their rests, I expect them to play fair just the same.

 

[rmcoen]

1) Short Rests in my campaign are an hour, and I generally limit them to "two per Long Rest". There is a Battlemaster/Rogue, Cleric, Rogue, Bard, and Warlock (celestial) in the group. During a short rest, the Rogue usually is scouting, the Bard is playing music, the Battlemaster and Warlock are regaining powers, and the Cleric... well, the player is usually not paying attention.

2) Warlocks are "magic-based martials". They are not Wizards/Sorcs. The 5th level Warlock doing 2d10+8 with a cantrip over and over is an output not matched by the Wizard or Sorcerer. The two spell slots are (in my mind) "just in case", not the focus of the class's abilities. The Warlock in my game (5th level now) has used Fly and Shatter; the one in the game where I play uses Form of Dread, and then Cure Wounds right before we rest.

On the other hand, I play a Sorcerer in that party with a Warlock. In the story we're playing right now, I conserve my magic a lot, frequently hitting a Long Rest with some magic remaining. We tend to have a "minion fight" and then a "boss fight"... but I'm always worried about the unexpected "wandering boss", so I hoard my spell points. On the other hand, during the last dungeon crawl adventure, we were always getting overwhelmed, either by aura/mass-attack bosses (spellcasting drider, electric crab-golem) or hordes of foes (gibbering guards, invisible duergar, dozens of cultists backed up by casters, etc.). I blew through my magic like there was no tomorrow... and ended up dragging along behind the group with just cantrips after they Short Rested. The dungeon was too dangerous for an 8-hour pause, and we were 4-levels down so just leaving them to scheme while we retreated wasn't a good option either. The Warlock did fine.

3) If one PC is taking a Short Rest and the others are busy doing things - like exploring, talking to NPCs, shopping, and maybe getting into fights - the player whose character is napping is getting left out. The other PCs might also - in character - get a little frustrated at their pal who is shirking. "Sorry guys, I can't scout... gotta 'commune with my Patron'!" or "You're going to go shopping? Can you pick up a dozen things for me? Sorry, I have to 'commune with my Patron'." If the majority of the group has Short Rest resources, though, then everyone takes that short rest... and the long-rest crew (if uninjured, like my Sorcerer usually is) are just twiddling their thumbs. I'm not about to go exploring by myself, so I just sit and wait for everyone to finish communing/exercising/bandaging. [I mean, my PC has an Addiction (Flaw), so he usually takes that time to "get mellow", but otherwise I have nothing to do.]

 

[Xetheral]

This is possible I guess, but it sounds pretty niche (and dull).

I'd also point out that this is yet another post that seems to be exploring hypotheticals. Did this happen in your game? Was it a problem?

Not in it's most extreme form, but I've seen Warlocks routinely use their ability to get slots back on a short rest to cast extra useful spells in situations where taking lots of short rests are easy.

And no, I don't see it as a problem at all--quite the opposite. The ability to do so is one of the Warlock class's main strengths, and a limit on short rests is therefore a serious nerf to a class that doesn't need nerfing.

 

[rmcoen]

The only issue I have is abuse. As I mentioned, in the game where I am a player, the Warlock uses cure wounds. We are 8th level, so that's potentially 8d8+8 healing (4d8+4, twice), every hour-and-12-seconds. Not necessarily in combat - he loves his Form of Dread - but healing the 93hp barbarian and the 75hp fighter both up to full after being knocked unconscious is just a couple hours' of napping. No HD consumed, no daily spell slots spent, no long-term expenditure of resources - and no Long Rest requirement.

 

[Asisreo]

The only issue I have is abuse. As I mentioned, in the game where I am a player, the Warlock uses cure wounds. We are 8th level, so that's potentially 8d8+8 healing (4d8+4, twice), every hour-and-12-seconds. Not necessarily in combat - he loves his Form of Dread - but healing the 93hp barbarian and the 75hp fighter both up to full after being knocked unconscious is just a couple hours' of napping. No HD consumed, no daily spell slots spent, no long-term expenditure of resources - and no Long Rest requirement.

Well, the fighter could do that anyways with their Second Wind feature, so the warlock doesn't actually need to cast cure wounds on them.

 

[iserith]

The only issue I have is abuse. As I mentioned, in the game where I am a player, the Warlock uses cure wounds. We are 8th level, so that's potentially 8d8+8 healing (4d8+4, twice), every hour-and-12-seconds. Not necessarily in combat - he loves his Form of Dread - but healing the 93hp barbarian and the 75hp fighter both up to full after being knocked unconscious is just a couple hours' of napping. No HD consumed, no daily spell slots spent, no long-term expenditure of resources - and no Long Rest requirement.

Is there no risk or cost to doing that? If not, why not? The DMG says both event-based and location-based adventures come with time pressures - the villain's timeline and random encounters, respectively. If there's no time pressure, then I would fully expect players to do what you say above. If there is time pressure, they at least have to take that into consideration and may find the cost outweighs the benefits.

 

[Xetheral]

The only issue I have is abuse. As I mentioned, in the game where I am a player, the Warlock uses cure wounds. We are 8th level, so that's potentially 8d8+8 healing (4d8+4, twice), every hour-and-12-seconds. Not necessarily in combat - he loves his Form of Dread - but healing the 93hp barbarian and the 75hp fighter both up to full after being knocked unconscious is just a couple hours' of napping. No HD consumed, no daily spell slots spent, no long-term expenditure of resources - and no Long Rest requirement.

Personally, I don't see that as abuse. Warlocks excel at giving the party the ability to trade time for magic in smaller time increments than the full casters can manage. I think that capability is one of the main strengths of the class, and it comes at the heavy opportunity cost of not having a full caster's loadout.

 

[Stoutstien]

I always recommend DMs to disregard the DMGs ad hoc suggestion on the ratio between rests because its such a shifting relationship that they didn't implement any balance into the design phase of 5e. It's basically trial and error for each table which sucks at first but eventual it pans out.

 

[AtomicPope]

I've played a pure Warlock, from 1st to 20th with several Boons, and the parity between long and short rests depends more on the campaign, DM, and the story you're telling. There were games were I didn't get a single short rest, but that also means no one did. So our Fighter didn't get his Martial Maneuvers or our Druid his Wildshape. Not to mention, no one got to rest and spend hit dice to heal up. As a Warlock, I took some Invocations that gave me powers that were not dependent on rest. Because our campaign was apocalyptic, we were fighting fiends, fallen angels, and elementals 24/7. Normally, an invocation like Chains of Carceri wouldn't get much mileage. I used it at least 3 times every session, with no need to rest. There's also the fact that at higher levels you're really only casting Hex once at 5th level, and then moving it from target to target until you short rest. That is overlooked by most. Rest seemed to be a bigger issue at lower levels than at higher levels where you have lots of Pact Abilities, Mystic Arcanum, and Invocations. Without the extra abilities you rely more on your 2 spell slots.

 

[tetrasodium]

Speaking as a gm I despise the short rest long rest split in o5e. The group is entirety incentivizsd to always always always say yes to blssyy Mc 5th level firebalsgetting both of them back as often as possible. Found a room with one door... Short rest... Come back and repeat if you don't find one next fight. As a gm it becomes tiresome having to constantly come up with excuses for why they can't take a short rest this time & expecting the gm to always use doom clocks to make up for wotc's design choice here does not always fit narratively.

I feel like the problem is exacerbated because repelling agonizing blast scales to be equivalent of a rather high level spell on its own and because with few medium duration buffs thst would be hurt by a short rest other than artillerist turrets there is never any reason for a player to say 'but my ability wou melt" when the Warlock wants to rest every fight.