Bad DMs/GMs

[Bedrockgames]

I would also agree that the DMNPC can be a issue, but to me it is just part of a bigger issue. Sometimes the party completely screws up your plans (not necessarily a bad thing) and the hardest thing for a DM to (at least for me) is take a deep breath and take it on the chin and then find a way to roll wth it. Sometime this requires you to tell the group you need half an hour to rework some stuff --- sometimes it means it becomes a board game night.

One of my big realizations as a GM was that it is perfectly fine for players to beat an adventure in ten minutes if they figure out a way to do so, and battles with the big bad guy don't have to last dramatically long (one of our best final battles invovled the PCs teleporting into the villain's court, killing him in one hit and leaving).

 

[jasper]

y'all miss one.
1.The DM who house rules outweight all the source books. And quote,"I know more about gaming that Gynax!". I lasted maybe 3 hours with that one.
2. Flavor of the month club. NPC game stype changes with each new Dragon mag or new spalt book.

 

[Hussar]

/snip

Can I ask what these GMs did, and how they responded when people first voiced their criticisms?

It's been a few years, so, bear with my memory.

As I recall, pretty much nothing. Issues were brought forward, usually a number of times, and, in all three cases, the group basically had just had enough and all it took was one person saying, "Y'know what? This blows, I'm out of here." and the groups up and left.

Like you said, it's down to experience. I've had more than my share of really bad DM's. I have. I have had good DM's with clashing playstyles, and that's a totally different thing. When that happens, I simply excuse myself and that's that.

But, again, like you said, far too many people see "oh, bad DM" posts as being from "whiney sore losers". That sort of thing just blows my mind. We KNOW, beyond a shadow of any doubt, that there are some really craptastic DM's out there. There have to be. It's Sturgeon's Law at work. When I polled En Worlders a while back on their experiences, a third of people said that the majority of their DM's were bad and almost two thirds of the total reported having multiple bad DM's over the years.

The white knighting of DM's just bugs me I guess.

 

[Elf Witch]

I worry about this as DM - I typically ask for PC backgrounds as an aid to my visualising the character and to help the player give personality to their PC. Sometimes there is inspirational stuff in a PC background that I can use in game, but often the background story is interesting but doesn't get used at-table. Players may resent that. The opposite problem is that whenever I prep a whole bunch of stuff off 1 PC's backstory, inevitably the player doesn't show up - in fact they typically drop the campaign! - and the work is wasted.

I think PC backgrounds are a good thing to get an idea of the character and does help the DM visualize the character.

I guess I should rephrase what bugs me. It is when a DM ask for background with hooks and you oblige and over the course of a campaign other players get their backgrounds used but yours never gets used.

If the DM does not like the hooks or does not think they can use them then how about talking to the player and working with them to come up with some that will fit the campaign.

To not do so can make the player start feeling that their character is not as important to the game as the rest.

 

[Bedrockgames]

But, again, like you said, far too many people see "oh, bad DM" posts as being from "whiney sore losers". That sort of thing just blows my mind. We KNOW, beyond a shadow of any doubt, that there are some really craptastic DM's out there. There have to be. It's Sturgeon's Law at work. When I polled En Worlders a while back on their experiences, a third of people said that the majority of their DM's were bad and almost two thirds of the total reported having multiple bad DM's over the years.

The white knighting of DM's just bugs me I guess.

I am not doubting your experience, but just from my own the reason why I conclude "poor losers" is because that is what I've seen. When I have seen someone complain about GMs in real life (especially when they've had multiple bad GMs) they usually turn out to be one of a few types: someone who can't take losing, someone who is just too picky about GMs or someone who takes the game way too seriously. Most of my gaming friends are pretty laid back. I haven't really had any problems with other GMs or players. There are some GMs I prefer over others, but it isn't the end of the world for me if the GM is less than stellar (as I said usually guys who are truly terrible only end up GMing one or two sessions).

 

[S'mon]

I think PC backgrounds are a good thing to get an idea of the character and does help the DM visualize the character.

I guess I should rephrase what bugs me. It is when a DM ask for background with hooks and you oblige and over the course of a campaign other players get their backgrounds used but yours never gets used.

If the DM does not like the hooks or does not think they can use them then how about talking to the player and working with them to come up with some that will fit the campaign.

To not do so can make the player start feeling that their character is not as important to the game as the rest.

I agree, I think it's a real problem, which I worry about. I do try to tell players if I can't see the useable hooks in their background, or I just draw a blank on applying them. However they often just say things like "It's there to be used"... (thanks, Neonchameleon!)
The typical result, and I see other GMs doing it too, is that a few PCs who seem to fit the central themes of the campaign become the central focus while others are peripheral. That's fine with some players - the 'Watchers' - but others need more time to shine.

 

[Lord Ipplepop]

Bad DM's fall into a few realms for me:
1) No imagination- even if you are using pre-printed modules, the players WILL do something, usually more than one thing, to screw you up. A good DM needs to handle it and find a way to allow the characters to do their insanity and get them back on track.
A DM who is writing his/her own adventures and can't get beyond the, "you meet in a bar and the bad guys attack." needs to work on their imagination. (my recommendation is go back to the 1ed missions)

2) No flexibility- Again, regardless of how many clues you give them as the the fact that they need to talk to the person in front of them, or go down the left hallway, or kill the Green Power Ranger, or whatever, they WILL do everything except what you have spent the last 3 hours of game time hinting to them about. A good DM will deal with it and continue on.

3) Not knowing the rules- If the DM doesn't know the rules (mostly), then the above are magnified. Also, if a DM is required to continue to dig through the books to find out what it is he needs to know in the middle of this particular mass melee, then the game slows down, and eventually stops.

4) Not being able to de-stress on the fly- We always build in cigarette breaks, or soda/beer runs, snack runs, whatever... usually after an intense battle, or every hour or so. That way, the DM gets a chance to look ahead and get ready for the next portion, and to take a breather. It also gives the players a chance to breathe. Built up pressure makes all of the above worse.

5) God Complex (the worst)- "I am in charge, what I say goes, I have control over your characters, I decide who lives or dies.

 

[Elf Witch]

I agree, I think it's a real problem, which I worry about. I do try to tell players if I can't see the useable hooks in their background, or I just draw a blank on applying them. However they often just say things like "It's there to be used"... (thanks, Neonchameleon!)
The typical result, and I see other GMs doing it too, is that a few PCs who seem to fit the central themes of the campaign become the central focus while others are peripheral. That's fine with some players - the 'Watchers' - but others need more time to shine.

I tend to get very involved in a game. I am interested in the world and its people. I try and tailor my character to fit in the world. I will admit I also start to get pissy when I don't get any spotlight. I don't mind sharing and waiting my turn but I do want a turn.

I have seen this happen in games I DM where a player may not fit as well as the rest. So I try and bring in something for that player. I have had the experience of being on the peripheral of the game and it was not fun.

in the game I mention earlier with my bow was an example of this. We were playing in Eberon and I made a ranger from Cyer who was going for the prestige class cyrean avenger. I had talked with the DM about this and he was yeah sounds good.

The game progresses and the DM never brings anything about the cyrean refugee issue into the game. Even though we were in the region where most of them had settled. We spent the bulk of the game dealing with one players big secret and the other player belonging to a group going around closing gates and we were his team even though we had never been told this or asked if we wanted to be part of it.

As characters we didn't even know there was a group that did this.

So I finally spoke to the DM and he said sorry just not interested in your background or dealing with the cyrean refugees. It would have been nice if spoke up months ago so I could adjust my character. When I asked if I could bring in one that would fit better he allowed but I had to come in two levels lower than everyone else and with no magic items.

I ended up quitting the game a few weeks later over this.

 

[Dice4Hire]

A few things that always tick me off.

Rules-bound: A GM who, for whatever reason, must go 100% by the rules, no matter how long it takes. Wing it, for heaven's sake. I know the most I started winging things in my 3.x campaigns, the more players liked it.

Start as Newbie: Yes, I know I died, but being 1st level in a 6th level group is not fun at all.

Problem player Zen: The problem player is ruining the game and everyone knows it, but the player sticks around and around and around. If someone is disrupting your game (even if it is me) boot him. The DM is the law around here and sometimes he or she needs to put their foot down.

 

[Dice4Hire]

I find backgrounds problematic as a DM. On one hand, I want to have the player write one, so I can get a feel for the character, and have a good idea of how the player views his or her character.

But using it is hard. Sometimes the area is just too far away, or the background just has enough differences from the CS that it is hard to play with.

A player of mine recently joined my game in Greyhawk and decided to bring in a dwarven battlerager Warhammer style. Personal doom and all.

The problem is, I do not real warhammer at all, and know nothing about the setting. Plus, last I checked Greyhawk dwarves did not do this stuff. SO I decided to make it a subset of dwarves, considered more or less insane by most dwarves.

Neither I nor the player is really satisfied.