Pathfinder 2E Balancing encounters (and converting stuff from other editions)

[5ekyu]

D&D 5E is too easy.
Monsters are not balanced verse PC's with:Higher stats from rolling ability scores,Feats,or Magic Items.
Add to that 5E's small math issues,Overpowered classes and races and PC's with all of those things and a strong sense of tactics destroy the game.

Sure DM's can fix it. Repair the damage and run a deadly 5E game but ...it's really such a altered game that most do not recognize it as their 5E.

Pathfinder 2E isn't like that. I am still learning the ropes on running it but I can already tell. Pathfinder 2E is a much more balanced game. The Monsters have clearly been balanced with typical pc's in mind. So it's going to be a much harder system to just dominate.

Also I want to call attention to this issue from the OP's post.

Less than stellar tactics, less than stellar positioning and definitely less than stellar dice rolling


A rpg that let players forget about tactics & positioning and roll like crap and not get hammered into the ground wouldn't be worth playing.

Otherwise why roll dice? You guys kill everything you WIN!

So far I really like Pathfinder 2E's harder nature. I was dissatisfied with having to add pages and pages of 5E house rules and rebalance pc's verse Monsters and all that Jazz.

Now don't get me wrong, Pathfinder's gonna have it's own issues to. I can already tell it's going to end up with too much of Pathfinder 1E's over crunch issues and book fever.

"A rpg that let players forget about tactics & positioning and roll like crap and not get hammered into the ground wouldn't be worth playing.
Otherwise why roll dice? You guys kill everything you WIN! "

I think you may have gone to an extreme the OP neither claimed nor endorsed.

"Less than stellar" is not a phrase I tend to equate to "forget sbout" or ' like crap". I take it as more like "average to below average" a maybe something like novice to inexperienced would produce.

5e is dialed do that a moderate encounter is safe - it's the cr matches level bog simple default score and so if a new gm and new players run that out of the box their characters likely live through fights while the players learn and enjoy.

It's much the same as if a novice GM and novice players knew enough here, it seems, to dial everything to Cr -2. But, odds are, these novices might not realize that right out of the box.

In 5e more experienced players eith more experienced builds and more experienced tactics can be challenged by more experienced gms throwing tougher encounters at them. CR is not scaled to make things so limited in 5e. It doesn't become "too difficult" as soon as the CR shift by 3-4 above - given the experienced bits above.

Seems to me the OP is not going in about no tactics, no positioning and crap tols as much as thst the "slope" od difficulty set by the mechanics is more like a ledge by a cliff... easy to plunge off a cliff.

My concern is how reactive is it? Do things go south so quickly and do severely that by the time you see the warning signs its already too late to change and adapt?

 

[Tony Vargas]

"Less than stellar" is not a phrase I tend to equate to "forget sbout" or ' like crap". I take it as more like "average to below average" a maybe something like novice to inexperienced would produce.

It's one of those pronoun-linked things. "Our tactics were less than stellar," "Your tactics were mediocre," "Their tactics were like crap."

...all the same tactics. It's tact, not tactics, that draws the line between Less than Stellar and Below Average and Crap.

5e is dialed do that a moderate encounter is safe - it's the cr matches level bog simple default score and so if a new gm and new players run that out of the box their characters likely live through fights while the players learn and enjoy.

Except that 1st is the most randomly-deadly level in 5e's progression, yes, exactly.
5e encounter balance is tuned for new/casual players to actually get to play the game for a bit before their characters die for the first time. It's one of the concessions 5e makes to make it more accessible to new players. Afterall, D&D is the only RPG with mainstream name recognition, it's going to draw new players.

PF2, OTOH, sounds like it's tuned to challenge experienced players, out the box. Afterall Paizo's fans are very experienced, serious players, who rejected 4e's relative balance & accessibility, violently, and presumably aren't satisfied with 5e, either. They've long since mastered 3.x/PF, there's little to challenge them in 5e. It actually makes a lot of sense for PF2 to be 'hard' out of the gate.