D&D 5E Banshee Wail: 0 hp and stable or 0 hp and dying?

[Maxperson]

I never found save-or-make-a-new-character to be all that scary. More annoying than anything.

I invest heavily in my characters. The chance that I would lose one just like that *snap* was terrifying.

In my experience, having multiple party members go down during a dangerous encounter is much more effective at ratcheting up tension, because then the party has to scramble to save the dying characters while simultaneously fending off the (likely uninjured) monsters. If the character is dead then, short of someone living having revivify on hand, they're no longer relevant to this scene (outside of possible reactions to that character's death).

To each his own.

Yep! Different strokes for different folks and all that.

 

[Fanaelialae]

I invest heavily in my characters. The chance that I would lose one just like that *snap* was terrifying.

As do I. Which is why it was annoying to me. To me, scary is more than someone jumping around a corner and shouting "Boo!", which is what SoD is like to me. It's a single roll, pass or fail. Frequently, when I faced SoD, there was little choice in the matter for a heroic character, which is the style I like to play (kill the banshee or let the innocent villagers die horribly). So either it did nothing, which was anti-climactic but pleasing to me in an I-didn't-just-lose-my-character kind of way, or it stole my investment in a way that I could not have reasonably averted. To me that was flat-out annoying, akin to the DM openly cheating (obviously it was not cheating because the rules supported it). As I DM, I avoided SoD like the plague, which annoyed me further because it prevented me from using some otherwise cool creatures (I wish I had thought of simply dropping the PC to zero).

For me at least, there's a lot more tension when PC(s) are unconscious and the rest of the party is scrambling to save them. This will often play out over several rounds, or RL minutes, creating a lot of tension at the table as the party struggles to stay alive and save their friend. I should mention that I wrote a program that randomizes initiative every round, that way no one knows if the healing will arrive in time, which certainly helps with this.

 

[psychophipps]

100% agreement with "Dying". Life sucks. Wear a hat. Roll that Death Save, homie!

 

[steeldragons]

0 hp and DEAD!

 

[Maxperson]

As do I. Which is why it was annoying to me. To me, scary is more than someone jumping around a corner and shouting "Boo!", which is what SoD is like to me. It's a single roll, pass or fail. Frequently, when I faced SoD, there was little choice in the matter for a heroic character, which is the style I like to play (kill the banshee or let the innocent villagers die horribly). So either it did nothing, which was anti-climactic but pleasing to me in an I-didn't-just-lose-my-character kind of way, or it stole my investment in a way that I could not have reasonably averted. To me that was flat-out annoying, akin to the DM openly cheating (obviously it was not cheating because the rules supported it). As I DM, I avoided SoD like the plague, which annoyed me further because it prevented me from using some otherwise cool creatures (I wish I had thought of simply dropping the PC to zero).

For me at least, there's a lot more tension when PC(s) are unconscious and the rest of the party is scrambling to save them. This will often play out over several rounds, or RL minutes, creating a lot of tension at the table as the party struggles to stay alive and save their friend. I should mention that I wrote a program that randomizes initiative every round, that way no one knows if the healing will arrive in time, which certainly helps with this.

I'd like to see a middle ground. Maybe failed save is 0 hit points, and if you fail a single death save you're a gonner. That would give it the teeth I'm looking for without it relying on a single roll.

I also get where you are coming from We just play a bit differently is all.

 

[cas206]

Thanks for the reply's. I've reread the relevant parts of the handbook and agree with 0 hp and death saves. I must have remembered incorrectly from either one of the the playtests or previous edition that drop to exactly 0 was a special circumstance that just knocked you out.

 

[Edwin Suijkerbuijk]

They used to be anyway. CR 4 where the wail only drops you to 0 isn't that scary.

It depends on your playstyle.
In our campaigns enemies tend to make sure characters are actualy dead unless they want to take prisoners.
combines with some low level melee undead they are very scary, each atack being 2 failed death saves.

 

[Nebulous]

And that's why it's not scary to me. The party has to roll badly. In 1e-3e, it just took a single character rolling badly. THAT was scary.

A banshee to me should be the powerful undead. I get that it's still got some bite, but it's waaaay diminished from prior editions.

The greater banshee in the (highly recommended and not to be missed Monster Manual Expanded) is CR 13, can cause paralysis as well as fear, a death kiss, and the wail to zero HP, but all the DCs are much much higher, spellcasting up to 6th level and legendary actions. It's terrifying.

 

[Nebulous]

It depends on your playstyle.
In our campaigns enemies tend to make sure characters are actualy dead unless they want to take prisoners.
combines with some low level melee undead they are very scary, each atack being 2 failed death saves.

This too. Have the banshee immediately touch someone at 0 hp next turn. This is the most effective way to kill 5e characters, hit them while they're down before someone raises them back up.

 

[Maxperson]

The greater banshee in the (highly recommended and not to be missed Monster Manual Expanded) is CR 13, can cause paralysis as well as fear, a death kiss, and the wail to zero HP, but all the DCs are much much higher, spellcasting up to 6th level and legendary actions. It's terrifying.

Is that a third party product? If so, who sells it?