Bards, Badass or Not

[Vegepygmy]

He shouldn't be forced to play something he doesn't want to play. This has nothing to do with how good or bad Bards are in any edition.

This.

But in my opinion, core-only bards are pretty weak compared to the other core classes. That isn't to say they can't be a lot of fun to play, but I would never describe them as "badass."

 

[Dandu]

Bards are definitely stronger than Paladins, Fighters, and Monks.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

I'd definitely add rogues to that list, possibly rangers too.

 

[Vegepygmy]

Stronger at what?

 

[Cavall]

I usually play my bards with the Healing Hymn alternative class feature from Complete Champion. This causes all healing spells to gain a +1 for each rank you have in your Perform skill. Most people think, "Ho hum," until you realize that if you have a +12 (let's say) to your Perform skill, a Cure Minor Wounds spell, which is zero level and usually heals only 1 point, suddenly heals 13 points. Imagine being able to do huge amounts of healing with zero-level spells.

Sadly errated so it stops at max bonus for caster level. So boosting cure lights to a level 2 cleric with your song would make it go to a d8 plus 5 (the max of a cure light wounds). The "benefit" is that having a level 8 bard with a level 8 cleric could heal 4d8 +19. Thats significant, but hardly jaw dropping.

They made the change after people did exactly what you just pointed out, use a cantrip to heal 13 points of damage.



That being said, bard is the best class in the game to me. It fills so many roles, supports so many other players (like boosting healing above, or melee damage or even casters). You just need to play it larger than life, not just some guy in the corner with a lute. Bards never are in the corner. I dont even know with a bardic knowledge roll if they would know what a corner is. They are the leaders, the deal makers and the face of the party. They support, they buff, they heal and they lead.

 

[Cavall]

Oh and they always... ALWAYS... get the girl.

 

[aboyd]

Sadly errated so it stops at max bonus for caster level.

Whaa?



What is the point, then? The cleric can get that bonus all on his or her own. The entire point was to make the healing spells do more than they normally can.

Ugh.

 

[Cavall]

I cant really argue that, except to say that in my example of the one casting, you could get to that point of "topped off limit" of where a spell could reach a LOT faster.

And I know that you can of course see their logic in not wanting to allow a cure minor to do the work of 20 cure minors and double whatever a cure moderate could hope for.

However, I would like to suggest a medium ground. Why not have it capped like is, but still add to the cap? So a cure light would cap at plus 5, but it would be d8 + 5 + 5 from the bard equalling +10 total. Cure mod could go to +20 then, then + 30 and +40 for the others? That way you still have to spend your bigger heals to pull off the most benefit, but still retain the punch of it for doing so and respect the fact a totally seperate class from the healer had to take a feat to allow your character to heal.

I think its a nice middle ground myself. I wouldn't allow it in the unerratted form as is, but in the form it is now, as you said whats the point?

 

[Dandu]

Stronger at what?

Skills, utility, and possibly combat.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

Didn't that alt cost you fascinate or inspire courage? I remember it being totally not worth the song it replaced, even with eratta. And holy crap is that errata dumb. Using your limited per day class feature to heal a whopping 13 hp with a cantrip? OMGBroken! Leave it WotC to smash the kneecaps of abilities that were perfectly fine and leave actual broken crap untouched...