DerianCypher
First Post
Hey, how are the rules coming along? 
Any estimated time of completion?
DC
Any estimated time of completion?
DC
Battlefield d20: rules for large combats
- Thread starter angramainyu
- Start date
angramainyu ,
How would you handle reach 10 feet or more?
Is it a 10*10 feet= 100 feet meaning reach of 2 squares??
since in order for two units to fight the edge is facing or touching each other. How does reach affect AoO or threatened areas?
Let me know since the players are kinda in a middle of a war and I might have then take a strategic role and order troops around and such.
I'm using most of your calculations into an excel sheet, made stat locks for orcs and ogres (100 , 200, 300, 400 in numbers). Going to do that with humans as well.
Let me know what you think about the reach. The only thing I can think of other than above is that they get an extra attack for each 5ft incriment in reach above the normal reach of 5 ft. makes for a tough fight from that perspective.
How would you handle reach 10 feet or more?
Is it a 10*10 feet= 100 feet meaning reach of 2 squares??
since in order for two units to fight the edge is facing or touching each other. How does reach affect AoO or threatened areas?
Let me know since the players are kinda in a middle of a war and I might have then take a strategic role and order troops around and such.
I'm using most of your calculations into an excel sheet, made stat locks for orcs and ogres (100 , 200, 300, 400 in numbers). Going to do that with humans as well.
Let me know what you think about the reach. The only thing I can think of other than above is that they get an extra attack for each 5ft incriment in reach above the normal reach of 5 ft. makes for a tough fight from that perspective.
Field test today:
Going to run a simulation with my players.
Orcs vs humans
Additional rules.
Morale checks: when a force is down to 50% of it's HP and 25% a d100 check is made.
Within the remaining %, the Force continues to attack.
Over the % by
10%- Defensive fighting
20%- Fall back defensive fighting
30% Retreat
40% Flee in panic
50% Surrender
Spells that grant or take away to attacks give or penalize the moral. 10% per point. Morale bonus or penalty leaves when spell duration is over.
Spells to be used:
Bless (+1 to attack, +10% to morale)
Bane (-1 to attack, -10% morale)
Doom (-2 attack, etc, -20% Morale)
Commander morale bonus (only when in the field fighting with troops, +20%)
Commander flees or dies (-20%)
Commander just commands, no bonus.
The following spells are based on level 1 cleric:
Cure light wounds heal 55 hp/turn (assuming a 100 count cleric force, if cleric count drops, use % of 55 to heal)
Cure minor wounds (10/turn, assumes full cleric count)
Bless (+1 att, +1 save vs fear, 1 turn duration)
Doom (-2 etc, for 1 turn)
----------
Angra I'll be doing more field test using your system and adding stuff that I create. I hope you don't mind.
Kyramus
Going to run a simulation with my players.
Orcs vs humans
Additional rules.
Morale checks: when a force is down to 50% of it's HP and 25% a d100 check is made.
Within the remaining %, the Force continues to attack.
Over the % by
10%- Defensive fighting
20%- Fall back defensive fighting
30% Retreat
40% Flee in panic
50% Surrender
Spells that grant or take away to attacks give or penalize the moral. 10% per point. Morale bonus or penalty leaves when spell duration is over.
Spells to be used:
Bless (+1 to attack, +10% to morale)
Bane (-1 to attack, -10% morale)
Doom (-2 attack, etc, -20% Morale)
Commander morale bonus (only when in the field fighting with troops, +20%)
Commander flees or dies (-20%)
Commander just commands, no bonus.
The following spells are based on level 1 cleric:
Cure light wounds heal 55 hp/turn (assuming a 100 count cleric force, if cleric count drops, use % of 55 to heal)
Cure minor wounds (10/turn, assumes full cleric count)
Bless (+1 att, +1 save vs fear, 1 turn duration)
Doom (-2 etc, for 1 turn)
----------
Angra I'll be doing more field test using your system and adding stuff that I create. I hope you don't mind.
Kyramus
The test was good. A lot of holes.
Morale definitely made it more interesting.
1 roll at 50% or when you first break the 50% mark. Second morale check at 25%
Or affected by Doom, or commander runs or dies.
I had Targets that break morale check leave the battle immediately. like after the opposing forces have harmed them, they deal the defensive damage then roll the morale and then they follow the course of action that morale stated for them.
I had 2 units from the orcs retreat
1 unit from the humans flee in panic
In the end the humans one due to the extra cleric unit and the drummers were stopped from sending the message for reinforcements.
I was running it as if it might be part of my campaign when I did the test.
Over all the system for hp and attacks works very well.
you'll need to figure what happens with archers as archers will have 2 damage tables. one for ranged and one for melee.
haven't tried any other things yet but will simulate more battlefield fights to see any holes.
The feats came out really well. The people fashioned their archers to have rapid shot and was doing double damage to the units.
Morale definitely made it more interesting.
1 roll at 50% or when you first break the 50% mark. Second morale check at 25%
Or affected by Doom, or commander runs or dies.
I had Targets that break morale check leave the battle immediately. like after the opposing forces have harmed them, they deal the defensive damage then roll the morale and then they follow the course of action that morale stated for them.
I had 2 units from the orcs retreat
1 unit from the humans flee in panic
In the end the humans one due to the extra cleric unit and the drummers were stopped from sending the message for reinforcements.
I was running it as if it might be part of my campaign when I did the test.
Over all the system for hp and attacks works very well.
you'll need to figure what happens with archers as archers will have 2 damage tables. one for ranged and one for melee.
haven't tried any other things yet but will simulate more battlefield fights to see any holes.
The feats came out really well. The people fashioned their archers to have rapid shot and was doing double damage to the units.
angramainyu
Community Supporter
Kyramus said:
Right now I've got reach listed as a circumstance modifier to the target's armor class. It does an approximate job of simulating the extra damage from AoOs when the creatures in one unit out-reach the other.
As for the whole thing, work is still continuing, although life has been pretty busy these past few weeks. I'll see if I can spare a few moments tonight to post some stuff on magic.
angramainyu
Community Supporter
Where I am with magic:
-most spells need to be dealt with on a spell-by-spell (and caster-by-caster) basis... although it's easy enough to generalze something like a wand of magic missile
-a simple look-up based on the difference between the force's save and the spell DC gives you the percentage that make and fail the save
-another look-up based on the number of creatures in a square, the damage the force has taken, and the area of the spell gives you the number of creatures affected
-combine those two, and you get the number of creatures that fail their save and the number that make it.
The obvious example is fireball... but that shows some of the problems. Really, against a force of single-hit-die creatures, it doesn't matter if it's a 10d6 or 5d6 fireball, it's ends up killing the same number of creatures, and thus should really do the same amount of damage. However, against tougher creatures, the difference between 10d6 or 5d6 could make a huge difference between the number of creatures that are killed or merely injured.
This is what I'm struggling with now.
-most spells need to be dealt with on a spell-by-spell (and caster-by-caster) basis... although it's easy enough to generalze something like a wand of magic missile
-a simple look-up based on the difference between the force's save and the spell DC gives you the percentage that make and fail the save
-another look-up based on the number of creatures in a square, the damage the force has taken, and the area of the spell gives you the number of creatures affected
-combine those two, and you get the number of creatures that fail their save and the number that make it.
The obvious example is fireball... but that shows some of the problems. Really, against a force of single-hit-die creatures, it doesn't matter if it's a 10d6 or 5d6 fireball, it's ends up killing the same number of creatures, and thus should really do the same amount of damage. However, against tougher creatures, the difference between 10d6 or 5d6 could make a huge difference between the number of creatures that are killed or merely injured.
This is what I'm struggling with now.
Last edited:
I kinda figured on that.
so far I'm working on the low level spells upwards.
Fireball is level 3 with min level 5 to cast as a wiz.
area is 20x20 hence 40% of the troops being affected.
Assuming this isn't a unit of wizards, 1 wiz casting a fireball could cause 17 points of damage per turn.
25 if they are using 10d6.
That isn't so bad to use. Saving throw is for full or half damage and that's it. No additional rules.
What do you think?
All that follows is you deducting the damage from the troop then roll morale check if any or continue fighting at their present % in HP.
Just a thought. I really really doubt there will be an army with a force of 100 level 5 wizards. Again only if this is a really high magic campaign and epic level to boot.
so far I'm working on the low level spells upwards.
Fireball is level 3 with min level 5 to cast as a wiz.
area is 20x20 hence 40% of the troops being affected.
Assuming this isn't a unit of wizards, 1 wiz casting a fireball could cause 17 points of damage per turn.
25 if they are using 10d6.
That isn't so bad to use. Saving throw is for full or half damage and that's it. No additional rules.
What do you think?
All that follows is you deducting the damage from the troop then roll morale check if any or continue fighting at their present % in HP.
Just a thought. I really really doubt there will be an army with a force of 100 level 5 wizards. Again only if this is a really high magic campaign and epic level to boot.
angramainyu
Community Supporter
I don't think legions of spell-casters are going to happen too often, so I'm not that worried about them. I think spell-casters need to be dealt with on an individual basis.
I'm now tossing around the idea of making a separate list of Battlefield spells that use their own mechanics. Some of these would be based on standard spells (like fireball) but creating new spells would allow me to vastly simplify the mechanics... something along the lines that the damage is based on the difference between the spell DC and the saving throw, and just toss the rest of the math out the window.
The advantage of it being very easy to use is offset by the fact that it breaks the idea that the system is a pure abstraction of the standard rules. Hmmm. I must ponder.
I'm now tossing around the idea of making a separate list of Battlefield spells that use their own mechanics. Some of these would be based on standard spells (like fireball) but creating new spells would allow me to vastly simplify the mechanics... something along the lines that the damage is based on the difference between the spell DC and the saving throw, and just toss the rest of the math out the window.
The advantage of it being very easy to use is offset by the fact that it breaks the idea that the system is a pure abstraction of the standard rules. Hmmm. I must ponder.
Sepulchrave II
Legend
Bump
This deserves to stay up there.
No suggestions at all to make: I completely trust your own holistic vision. Eager to see more.
This deserves to stay up there.
No suggestions at all to make: I completely trust your own holistic vision. Eager to see more.
mkletch
First Post
Vaxalon said:
I see the primary need for this system being the Leadership feat. What if a character leads his followers and massed hirelings into combat with an opposing army? A batch of encounters or random DM decision just doesn't qualify. I'm approaching this situation in a campaign that I run, and it would be interesting to see how well this tool will work.
-Fletch!
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