Best Archer Build?

[starwed]

Don't forget Improved Manyshot (which is in XPH/Psionic SRD, for some reason.) It lets you get multiple attacks just like Manyshot, but now each is a regular attack. You can apply precision based damage to each one, too. ^_^

A level 12 scout can have all the feats you listed, and get skirmish damage on multiple attacks via Improved Manyshot. And of course, you get a nice assortment of extra abilities.

 

[Pickaxe]

Yes. Look at the list of feats for a straight "archer" fighter, slightly modified from above:

Result is MAB +14/+14/+9/+4 (+Dex) damage d10+4+Str over fantastic range. And basically no skills (30 skill points +15*Int mod), more hp, and worse saves (+8,+4,+4).

Compare to Rgr 2/ Ftr 4/ Rog 6:

Result is MAB +11/+11/+6/+1 (+Dex) damage d8+2(+3d6)+Str over fantastic range. And more skills (86 skill points +15*Int mod), significantly lower hp (but this is a ranged combatant), but better saves (+9, +9, +3). So basically puchasing a conditional ranged PA for a loss to BAB

The fighter is basically unable to take care of non-combat situations at all. Rgr/Ftr/Rog probably has a decent Tumble skill, and a few other skills to help out and about. The fighter's biggest boon vs the Rgr/Ftr/Rog is Improved Precise Shot.

Average damage for 3d6 is 10.5. If you get to sneak attack 50% of the time (which I think is generous), the average damage is 5.25 per hit. That's +1.25 per attack, at -3 to hit. That doesn't necessarily sound better to me, especially if sneak attack opportunities are limited. The saves are nice, but you also have a lot fewer hit points, and one of your feats is tied to light or no armor. I don't see how attacking at range makes a difference to hit points, especially at this level; there are plenty of ways you can lose lots of hit points at range. If hit points weren't important, you'd see fewer people downgrading elves because of the Con hit.

As far as versatility goes, I think that's only going to be important if the party has no one else with many skill points. After all, the OP wanted an archer, not a high Diplomacy modifier. I would remove the non-core feats and Improved Initiative from the fighter, and I'd add either Power Attack and Cleave or Dodge and Mobility; the latter would eliminate most needs for tumbling. The additional rogue levels and the reliance on light armor make melee more dangerous, and I don't think a fighter should assume that he can avoid melee all the time. Adding PA makes allows the fighter to bring a nasty greatsword to the party at need.

--Axe

 

[Legildur]

Well, crossbows are a whole different ballgame. I haven't done all the math out on an optimized xbow build, but off the cuff, I think it would come out behind the archer. However, I still think it can be very valuable as a way to give a rogue more options for getting in his sneak attack.

Crossbow has style for a rogue. Besides that, yeah, it's suboptimal. You can, however, fire a crossbow from the prone position, which grants you a further +4 bonus to AC versus ranged attacks. This can sometimes prove useful.

 

[mcgeedis]

This is exactly the post that I was looking for.

I am going to be running the Rogue variant from Unearthed Arcana where I will be giving up sneak attack for the Fighter bonus feat progression. Why do this do you ask? Well, the tip that I was given by our DM was that there was going to be plenty of undead for us to face. I was originally supposed to be the party's fighter, but someone else stepped into that role. And, we were missing a skill based character that could take care of non-combat situations (traps, locks, diplomacy, etc...).


Now, given the same feat progression as defined earlier:


Point Blank Shot
Precise Shot
Rapid Shot
Exotic Weapon Proficiency [Greatbow]
Weapon Focus [Greatbow]
Quickdraw
Manyshot
Improved Rapid Shot
Improved Critical [Greatbow]
Far Shot
Improved Precise Shot
.
.
.
.
- what would be the better ability scores to take (also from the 28 point buy system) and still be a skill based character that can be a decent ranged attack character with the BAB of a Rogue? Race is also undecided at this point...

 

[Korak]

This is exactly the post that I was looking for.

- what would be the better ability scores to take (also from the 28 point buy system) and still be a skill based character that can be a decent ranged attack character with the BAB of a Rogue? Race is also undecided at this point...

Well, to get more skill points at 28 point buy, you have to sacrifice something... since you don't have to be the party's main fighter, perhaps you can sack 2 points of con, and a bit of strength.... maybe sub in Weapon Finesse for Far Shot (if you aren't going to do peerless archer) or delay Improved Critical in favor of Weapon Finesse... if you feel you need a separate melee option. You might just deal with no melee threatening since you can fire without provoking AoOs.

so... how bout

Human
Str: 14 (10 base + 4 item)
Dex: 23 (16 base + 4 item + 3 level)
Con: 16 (14 base + 2 item)
Int: 14
Wis: 10
Cha: 10

11 skill points / level, no negative mental stats, and you maintain a good hit mod while only losing 2dmg per shot.

 

[JiffyPopTart]

Right now I am playing a Human Fighter2/Warmage5 who is a pretty good bowyer. As I stated on another thread you can pull off a pretty funny combo...

Greatbow+TrueStrike+Accuracy=Shooting 2600 feet away (and yes, you can't really see this far) with no penalty to-hit.

Eventually I am going to get Smiting Spell feat which will let me attach most of my warmage damage dealing spells to an arrow and shoot someone with them. I am most salivating over shooting arrows with Poison cast on them...those would be nasty.

DS

 

[MarkB]

Right now I am playing a Human Fighter2/Warmage5 who is a pretty good bowyer. As I stated on another thread you can pull off a pretty funny combo...

Greatbow+TrueStrike+Accuracy=Shooting 2600 feet away (and yes, you can't really see this far) with no penalty to-hit.

Could create a new combat trend - instead of scry-and-teleport, use scry-and-shoot.

 

[Legildur]

Could create a new combat trend - instead of scry-and-teleport, use scry-and-shoot.

LOL! Scry through a familiar. Talk about indirect fire support and a forward observer!

 

[Venator]

Hey, new to these boards! Glad to be here, and wow what a great thread. I have been looking for an up to date discussion on this exact topic for a long time. The WotC boards seem to be okay at best.

Anyways, I too am currently playing an Archer in a home game. The build i chose is the following:

Fighter12

(1st) 1 - Point Blank Shot
(1st) Ftr1 - Precise Shot
(2nd) Ftr2 - Weapon Focus (Longbow)
(3rd) 3 - Rapid Shot
(4th) Ftr3 - Coordinated Shot
(6th) 6 - Weapon Spec. (Longbow)
(6th) Ftr4 - Many Shot
(8th) Ftr5 - Ranged Weapon Mastery (Piercing)
(9th) 9 - Improved Critical
(10th) Ftr6 - Greater Weapon Focus (Longbow)
(12th) 12 - Greater Weapon Spec (Longbow)
(12th) Ftr7 - Improved Precise Shot

I am currently only 6th level, so the feat at 9th may change to either:
Imp. Rapid shot
Power Attack (for those times where i need to defend the wizard, weather is really bad, or having DR problems)
or Imp. Init (pre-req for Occult Slayer)

Taking Coordinated Shot at 4th was a no-brainer due to playing up from first. It really really helps to ingore allies for purposes of cover. If you are playing in a game where you often fight in a dungeon-esque setting its invaluable until 12th where you can pick up Imp. Precise.

The biggest problem im running into now is where to take the character after 12th level.

Dipping into Ranger for a level to pick up favored enemy and the ability to use wands seems nice. I could then switch back to Fighter and take some of the feats ive missed and Imp. Favored Enemy.

Ive been considering Occult Slayer from Complete Warrior to help me cover my weak Will save. It also fits the character pretty well.

Peerless Archer would be an idea... if only it was 3.5...

Lastly, i could simply continue all the way to Fighter20, take all the great feats and a few of the "tricks" like Ranged Disarm, and cap it off with Weapon Supremacy at 18th.

Thoughts?

 

[Moon-Lancer]

whats improved cover? I cant find it anyplace? I dident think thier were any degrees of cover anymore.