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Best...Puzzle...Ever....
- Thread starter RithTheAwakener
- Start date
Calico_Jack73 said:
Feh. No big deal. Just apply a Remove Disease every few days and you get to keep your uber weapon. A lead-lined scabbard wouldn't hurt neither.
See, I loved Grimtooth's Traps when they first came out, because they were a great way to encourage caution over brute force. They kept players on their toes.
Then in later editions, they just became inescapable means of killing off the players no matter how well they used their heads (although they did often fail to keep in mind that players have access to magic). I'd certainly avoid any DM who owned one of those books.
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Tuzenbach
First Post
MerakSpielman said:
Alright. Are you familiar at all with the "Riddles in the Dark" chapter of "The Hobbit"? Not the riddles that had as their answers "eggs" or "the sun on daisies", but I based this riddle on the other "least" riddle from that chapter that I thought was stupid once the answer was revealed.
Saeviomagy
Adventurer
Impeesa said:I didn't use a formula of any sort, when I did it mostly in my head I was just keeping track of a few important points, and my computer model did indeed run through the process manually to confirm my first answer. Yours is so very close to mine that it probably is just a case of clouded memory.
--Impeesa--
976
I'm guessing that the solution is to
find out which numbers satisfy an equation which represents each step - for the first 4 levels, the prisoner must be divisible by 16. However I've got some problems when the sequence shifts by a number - In the first instance it means that the winning prisoner's number is NOT divisible by 32. Unfortunately I've got no idea what to do on the next step after that - however we're down to a set of only 16 numbers, which is manageable on paper
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Saeviomagy
Adventurer
I'm assuming rules lawyer was supposed to be derogatory. The game is based on rules. If the rules of the game are incorrectly communicated, then it's not the fault of the games participants. If A DM pulled your little puzzle on my character, then I highly doubt that my first thought would be to treat it as a logic puzzle - I'd start by scrutinizing the rules of the game, and seeing how they could be used to favour me. After all - if the GM doesn't stick to his OWN rules, then it's just another "some (word for a nasty man) buries you in the sand to die" encounter, not a riddle.Trainz said:I'm not DMing here... if you want to be a rules lawyer about it, go ahead.
Two guys already found the answer. Go look in the previous page.
Witness the current series on KoTD - the solution of the riddle IS to closely interpret the wording.
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Saeviomagy
Adventurer
Malchior said:
For a swinging pendulum, T=2pi*sqrt(L/g). Use your own height to measure off a length of rope. Bundle up the rest of the rope into a heavy knot and tie it to the end of the rope. Most characters know their own height, because it's written right there on the top of their character sheet. Swing your newly manufactured pendulum, work out the numbers.
As you can see, I like avoiding the obvious answers to riddles like these.
FireLance
Legend
Malchior said:Okay, here's my riddle (told to me by my cousin).
You have two lengths of rope that are alchemically treated to burn. You have to accomplish a very important task in exactly 45 minutes. You have absolutely nothing except the ropes for using to tell time (no sunlight to make a sundial, magic won't work, etc.) In the riddle as given to me, a boy needed CPR for exactly 45 mins to live but the actual task could be anything needing exactly 45 mins of time.
As mentioned, the ropes have been alchemically treated to burn completely. You know that one rope (we'll call it rope A) will burn completely in exactly one (1) hour. You know that the second rope (let's call it, oh, I don't know, rope B?) will burn completely in thirty (30) minutes.
IMPORTANT: The ropes do NOT burn consistantly! ie. Rope A might burn really quickly for a while, then slowly, then quickly, etc. unpredictably until consumed in one hour. Thus cutting a rope will NOT help.
Soooo... how do you utilize these ropes to time exactly 45 minutes?
The answer.... coming soon.
In the (slightly) more difficult version of this puzzle, both the ropes burn for 1 hour, and you still need to measure 45 minutes.
FireLance
Legend
Impeesa said:I did it in my head*, then cranked off a computer simulation and got the same answer both times:. Is that the answer you were looking for?976
*I did make a few scribbled notes, but none of them involved writing out who was left and crossing them off. Basically just the upper and lower bounds of who was left after each iteration, which I also would have tracked in my head were I not so easily distracted.Hint to anyone still trying: At the point where you go from 125 left to 62 left, the rounding kicks in, shifts things over a bit, and #512 bites it pretty quickly IIRC.
--Impeesa--
I got the same answer by iteration, using the following rules:
Let S be the number of survivors after a round. Let I be the number of completed rounds (I = 0 for the first round). Let L be the number of the lowest-numbered survivor. Let K be a variable = 1 if the first survivor in a round is killed ; K = 0 if the first survivor in a round is spared.
After every round I, the survivors will be the set of numbers given by n x 2^I + L, n going from 0 to S-1.
ITERATION (for every round I):
1. L = K x 2^I + L (the survivors will always be 2^I apart; if the last survivor in the previous round was killed [K=0], L does not change, otherwise L becomes the second survivor)
2a. If S even, S = S/2 (if S is even, the number of survivors is exactly halved; K does not change because if the first survivor was killed in the previous round, the first survivor will be killed in the next round, too)
2b. If S odd, S = (S+1)/2 - K, K = 1 - K (if S is odd, the number of survivors is halved and rounded down if the first survivor was killed and rounded up if he was not; K changes - if the first survivor was killed in the previous round, the first survivor will be spared in the next round, and vice-versa)
REPEAT ITERATION until S = 1.
The final survivor will be given by the final value of L.
If we start with S = 1000, L = 1 and K = 1 (first killed), the final value of L will be 976.
After every round I, the survivors will be the set of numbers given by n x 2^I + L, n going from 0 to S-1.
ITERATION (for every round I):
1. L = K x 2^I + L (the survivors will always be 2^I apart; if the last survivor in the previous round was killed [K=0], L does not change, otherwise L becomes the second survivor)
2a. If S even, S = S/2 (if S is even, the number of survivors is exactly halved; K does not change because if the first survivor was killed in the previous round, the first survivor will be killed in the next round, too)
2b. If S odd, S = (S+1)/2 - K, K = 1 - K (if S is odd, the number of survivors is halved and rounded down if the first survivor was killed and rounded up if he was not; K changes - if the first survivor was killed in the previous round, the first survivor will be spared in the next round, and vice-versa)
REPEAT ITERATION until S = 1.
The final survivor will be given by the final value of L.
If we start with S = 1000, L = 1 and K = 1 (first killed), the final value of L will be 976.
Fieari
Explorer
I have two books here labeled "Usborne Superpuzzles: Advanced Level" one of which is titled "Logic Puzzles" and the other "Map & Maze Puzzles". Both have a warning on the front: "WARNING: SERIOUSLY DIFFICULT PUZZLES"
They aren't kidding about that warning.
A while ago, I tried taking one of the puzzles and seeing how I could modify it to fit into a D&D campaign. It was similar to the "there are two guys, one who always lies, one who always tells the truth" puzzle, except much more difficult, and besides, the statements the characters made were fixed. So I made it so that an NPC asked the questions, and the PCs would then be able to question the NPC for the information. For convenience, I had the NPC be a rouge in an NPC adventuring party who had given up the quest, yet had also recorded this conversation into a gem (how handy!) so that the PCs could analyze it.
The other rogue had discovered through the rumor-mill that a band of five travelling performers was comming into town, and that they also knew the location of YE OLDE ARTIFACT OF POWER. It also seemed that one of the performers was a paladin travelling with the group across the mountains (performing with them along the way), and as such never lied. Another performer, previously an adventurer, had befallen a nasty curse that made it so that every word he spoke was a lie. The other three performers were just average guys... but they didn't particularly like people asking them questions and would often try to be deliberately misleading... that is to say, sometimes they'd tell the truth, and sometimes they'd lie. You never could tell.
The NPC rogue tracked the performers down, and found a Drummer, a Piper, a Jester, a Juggler, and to really draw the croud, someone who had been (hopefully temporarily!) polymorphed into the form of a Bear. The conversation (recorded) went a little something like this:
NPC Rogue: So... what can you tell me about the whereabouts of the artifact of power?
Drummer: I can tell you that you must take the road towards the town of Tabor.
Polymorphed Bear: You say no such thing!
Piper: You must take the road to the city of Mandolin.
Jester: I agree. Take the road to Mandolin.
Piper: Errr... umm... Let's see... it was either to Tabor or to Mandolin. One of those two. Definitely one of those two.
NPC Rogue: Um... okay. Where do I go after that?
Drummer: At the crossroads, you must go to Castle Gargoylia.
Polymorphed Bear: No, you must NOT go to the Castle Gargoylia!
Jester: Right, you must go to the Castle of Arc instead.
Juggler: Go to Castle Gargoylia.
NPC Rogue: Right. So... which one of you... you know, always tells the truth?
Drummer: I sometimes lie, and sometimes tell the truth.
Juggler: That's a lie!
Jester: Well, I can say this. If the polymorphed bear is always truthful, the juggler is the one who tells nothing but lies.
Polymorphed Bear: The Jester is lying.
Piper: The Drummer always tells the truth. Always.
Jester: The piper speaks nothing but lies! Lies I tell you!
NPC Rogue: That... doesn't really help. Look, I'll figure it out later. When I get to... ah... whereever it is. What do I do then?
Drummer: At the castle you must find the sage. He'll show you where to get the artifact.
Juggler: You must find the pageboy.
Polymorphed Bear: Find the cook! Find the cook!
NPC Rogue: I can't take any more of this bloody nonsense! *storms out*
Can you guys figure out where to go?
They aren't kidding about that warning.
A while ago, I tried taking one of the puzzles and seeing how I could modify it to fit into a D&D campaign. It was similar to the "there are two guys, one who always lies, one who always tells the truth" puzzle, except much more difficult, and besides, the statements the characters made were fixed. So I made it so that an NPC asked the questions, and the PCs would then be able to question the NPC for the information. For convenience, I had the NPC be a rouge in an NPC adventuring party who had given up the quest, yet had also recorded this conversation into a gem (how handy!) so that the PCs could analyze it.
The other rogue had discovered through the rumor-mill that a band of five travelling performers was comming into town, and that they also knew the location of YE OLDE ARTIFACT OF POWER. It also seemed that one of the performers was a paladin travelling with the group across the mountains (performing with them along the way), and as such never lied. Another performer, previously an adventurer, had befallen a nasty curse that made it so that every word he spoke was a lie. The other three performers were just average guys... but they didn't particularly like people asking them questions and would often try to be deliberately misleading... that is to say, sometimes they'd tell the truth, and sometimes they'd lie. You never could tell.
The NPC rogue tracked the performers down, and found a Drummer, a Piper, a Jester, a Juggler, and to really draw the croud, someone who had been (hopefully temporarily!) polymorphed into the form of a Bear. The conversation (recorded) went a little something like this:
NPC Rogue: So... what can you tell me about the whereabouts of the artifact of power?
Drummer: I can tell you that you must take the road towards the town of Tabor.
Polymorphed Bear: You say no such thing!
Piper: You must take the road to the city of Mandolin.
Jester: I agree. Take the road to Mandolin.
Piper: Errr... umm... Let's see... it was either to Tabor or to Mandolin. One of those two. Definitely one of those two.
NPC Rogue: Um... okay. Where do I go after that?
Drummer: At the crossroads, you must go to Castle Gargoylia.
Polymorphed Bear: No, you must NOT go to the Castle Gargoylia!
Jester: Right, you must go to the Castle of Arc instead.
Juggler: Go to Castle Gargoylia.
NPC Rogue: Right. So... which one of you... you know, always tells the truth?
Drummer: I sometimes lie, and sometimes tell the truth.
Juggler: That's a lie!
Jester: Well, I can say this. If the polymorphed bear is always truthful, the juggler is the one who tells nothing but lies.
Polymorphed Bear: The Jester is lying.
Piper: The Drummer always tells the truth. Always.
Jester: The piper speaks nothing but lies! Lies I tell you!
NPC Rogue: That... doesn't really help. Look, I'll figure it out later. When I get to... ah... whereever it is. What do I do then?
Drummer: At the castle you must find the sage. He'll show you where to get the artifact.
Juggler: You must find the pageboy.
Polymorphed Bear: Find the cook! Find the cook!
NPC Rogue: I can't take any more of this bloody nonsense! *storms out*
Can you guys figure out where to go?
Fieari
Explorer
It's always good to have multiple options.
Another set of musicians is playing in town now. They don't have any quirkes with lying or telling the truth, but that doesn't really matter much, as they don't talk to anyone uninvited. No, not even adventurers.
The gem recording from the previous puzzle makes it clear that those performers only knew someone who knew where the artifact was. However, rumors in the tavern suggest that one of these performers, the one named Aramis, comes from the mountain town near the ruins where the artifact is located.
The performers only come out to play their instruments, then retreat to their wagons. They play in two pavilions, shielded from the sun, one with a red flag and the other with a yellow flag. Each performer has the name of his or her hometown written on his or her music stand. The players are arranged as follows:
(Note, if not listed as having a cloak or hat, they don't have a cloak or hat)
Red Flagged Pavillion:
Rear Left Position: A horn player, wearing a red hat. From Bergamot
Rear Center Position: A pipe player, wearing a brown hat and a red cloak. From Kesar
Rear Right Position: A lute player, wearing a white hat and a yellow cloak. From Fenugreek
Front Left Position: A bass lute player, with neither hat nor cloak. From Paprika
Front Right Position: A tamborine player, wearing a white hat. From Turmeric
Yellow Flagged Pavillion:
Rear Left Position: A horn player, wearing a white hat and a red cloak. From Juniper
Rear Right Position: A pipe player, wearing a brown hat and a red cloak. From Caraway
Front Left Position: A tamborine player, wearing a white hat. From Tarragon
Front Center Position: A didgeridoo player, wearing a blue hat and a yellow cloak. From Azira
Front Right Position: A violin player, wearing a red cloak, and a white hat. From Haldi
As they play, the players overhear gossip in the croud as relating to the performer's names. (these can be assumed to be true)
Overheard #1: Lalik is at Izarin's left side.
Overheard #2: Balbek is over there in the pavillion with the red flag.
Overheard #3: Sulah is at Balbek's side.
Overheard #4: Aramis and Faron are in the same pavillion, but aren't next to each other.
Overheard #5: Balbek wears a white hat whenever Korabeth wears one.
Overheard #6: Qat is in the front row of one of the two pavillions.
Overheard #7: Aramis wears a cloak whenever Haliah wears one.
Overheard #8: Haliah is at Raban's side.
Overheard #9: Aramis wears a white hat, but only if Lalik wears a cloak.
Overheard #10: Korabeth is in the yellow flagged pavillion.
From this, can the players skip right to the town they need to go, and not even bother with the Castle Arc or Gargoylia and the inhabitants thereof?
Another set of musicians is playing in town now. They don't have any quirkes with lying or telling the truth, but that doesn't really matter much, as they don't talk to anyone uninvited. No, not even adventurers.
The gem recording from the previous puzzle makes it clear that those performers only knew someone who knew where the artifact was. However, rumors in the tavern suggest that one of these performers, the one named Aramis, comes from the mountain town near the ruins where the artifact is located.
The performers only come out to play their instruments, then retreat to their wagons. They play in two pavilions, shielded from the sun, one with a red flag and the other with a yellow flag. Each performer has the name of his or her hometown written on his or her music stand. The players are arranged as follows:
(Note, if not listed as having a cloak or hat, they don't have a cloak or hat)
Red Flagged Pavillion:
Rear Left Position: A horn player, wearing a red hat. From Bergamot
Rear Center Position: A pipe player, wearing a brown hat and a red cloak. From Kesar
Rear Right Position: A lute player, wearing a white hat and a yellow cloak. From Fenugreek
Front Left Position: A bass lute player, with neither hat nor cloak. From Paprika
Front Right Position: A tamborine player, wearing a white hat. From Turmeric
Yellow Flagged Pavillion:
Rear Left Position: A horn player, wearing a white hat and a red cloak. From Juniper
Rear Right Position: A pipe player, wearing a brown hat and a red cloak. From Caraway
Front Left Position: A tamborine player, wearing a white hat. From Tarragon
Front Center Position: A didgeridoo player, wearing a blue hat and a yellow cloak. From Azira
Front Right Position: A violin player, wearing a red cloak, and a white hat. From Haldi
As they play, the players overhear gossip in the croud as relating to the performer's names. (these can be assumed to be true)
Overheard #1: Lalik is at Izarin's left side.
Overheard #2: Balbek is over there in the pavillion with the red flag.
Overheard #3: Sulah is at Balbek's side.
Overheard #4: Aramis and Faron are in the same pavillion, but aren't next to each other.
Overheard #5: Balbek wears a white hat whenever Korabeth wears one.
Overheard #6: Qat is in the front row of one of the two pavillions.
Overheard #7: Aramis wears a cloak whenever Haliah wears one.
Overheard #8: Haliah is at Raban's side.
Overheard #9: Aramis wears a white hat, but only if Lalik wears a cloak.
Overheard #10: Korabeth is in the yellow flagged pavillion.
From this, can the players skip right to the town they need to go, and not even bother with the Castle Arc or Gargoylia and the inhabitants thereof?
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