Better, detailed firearms mechanics?

[CarlZog]

I'm looking for games with detailed, yet playable, rules for firearms. I haven't seen much, but what I've seen of D20 Modern just isn't enough. (Or maybe I am just overlooking something.)

Can anyone tell me what other games (d20-based or not) provide more graphic, detailed firearms combat?

The kind of things I'm looking for are hit location and effects (if you're shot in the leg, you can't run up the stairs); varying effects of real and futuristic weapons; incremental damage from blood loss, etc. Mind you, I don't want to spend an hour working out the results of every bullet fired -- or attempted to be fired. Playability does matter.

I'm sure there's tons of stuff at my doorstep, I just need to be pointed in the right direction.

PS -- I wasn't sure where to post this, so it ended up here.

Thanks

zog

 

[Hand of Evil]

Pirateer Press makers of Iron Kingdom had/has a good free download for them...http://66.34.111.89/Publishers/privateer_firearms.pdf

Does not have hit locations and details.

 

[HellHound]

Wow.

You want all the complexity of realistic firearms without the pain it brings to the gaming table.

For the rules you are asking for - I'd recommend Phoenix Command. But it DOES take a few minutes to resolve each shot in that system.

Other systems that handle firearms fairly well include R.Talsorian Games' CyberPunk...

 

[CarlZog]

Wow.

You want all the complexity of realistic firearms without the pain it brings to the gaming table.

Well...yeah. Is it too much to ask?

For the rules you are asking for - I'd recommend Phoenix Command. But it DOES take a few minutes to resolve each shot in that system.

Other systems that handle firearms fairly well include R.Talsorian Games' CyberPunk...

I'd never heard of Phoenix Command before, but I just glanced at a couple related websites... Holy cow! That's probably a bit too far in the other direction, but a quote on one of the pages highlights part of my reason for looking for new rules:

[size=-1]"Using your current small arms combat system, place the muzzle of a large calibre pistol between your character's eyes. Squeeze the trigger. Continue squeezing the trigger until the character falls unconscious. Then, have a friend put a band-aid over that nasty .45 calibre dent in his skull and try not to get him shot too often in the week or two it takes to heal." [/size]

[size=-1]"Now, using Phoenix Command, place the same pistol in the same place. Squeeze the trigger. You now have a choice: you can either roll up a new character or rush the body to a very sophisticated medical facility and discover the joys of role-playing a vegetable."[/size]

​

I had Cyberpunk, but never played it. Sold it during one of my more misguided efforts at cleaning out. Maybe, I'll have to take another look.

Thanks

zog

 

[Calico_Jack73]

Twilight:2000 is great too AND it is available for free this month at Drive Thru RPG.

 

[Wystan]

AEG:
Spycraft: Modern Arms Guide (MAG)

Palladium: Compendium of Contemporary Weapons

I have both of these and prefer the AEG book.

Also look here for a sample of the style AEG uses with this free Web Enhancement:
http://www.spycraftccg.com/rpg/spycraft_mag_chapter9.pdf

 

[BiggusGeekus]

I had Cyberpunk, but never played it. Sold it during one of my more misguided efforts at cleaning out. Maybe, I'll have to take another look.

The CP system is pretty cool. It goes under the assumption that most shots miss, but when the bullets hit, someone gets hurt.

D&D/d20 is more heroic. Hit points are a highly abstract system which doesn't really translate well into real-world terms.

 

[Marius Delphus]

The 2E AD&D Player's Option: Combat & Tactics critical hit system could be adapted to this purpose. Pick your lethality level:

• Superheroic: Use normal rules to resolve hits. Use C&T critical (piercing) rules instead of damage multiplier when a critical hit is dealt (use damage multiplier as a guide to the severity of critical hits).
• Cinematic: Use normal rules to resolve hits. Use C&T critical rules plus damage multiplier when a critical hit is dealt.
• Realistic: Use ranged touch attacks to resolve hits. Use C&T critical rules plus damage multiplier when a critical hit is dealt.
• Gritty: Use ranged touch attacks to resolve hits. Use C&T critical rules (plus damage multiplier, on critical hit) whenever any damage is dealt.

N.B. This "system" has not been playtested in any way, shape, or form. Be ready to alter as needed.


Enjoy!

 

[Janx]

CarlZog's example of a gun to the forehead applies to swords as well. Hit Point pools don't model called shots very well.

If you're doing Hit Points (particularly in games where HP goes up as you get better, but the damage doesn't), then you should describe the effect AFTER you compare the damage and remaining HP.

Otherwise, a simple solution is to lock HP to a standard, low number. Basically, 10. Everyone gets 10 HP. Period. Really. Now all weapon attacks (with criticals possible) make sense in that scope. For added realism, maybe add some HP for size. Otherwise, that's it. Don't like dying? Wear some armor, maybe you won't get hit. Want side effects from hit locations, just guess, lessee you got 2/10 HP left, I'm guessing you're hurt pretty bad from that last shotgun blast. Want to make it so damage and attack aren't seperate? Simple, damage = the difference between the to-hit number, and the actual number rolled (0 or less means the shot missed).

The result in the above example is a probably playable but very lethal combat system. I sure as heck wouldn't want to get in a figth...

Janx

 

[The Grumpy Celt]

The kind of things I'm looking for are hit location and effects

I don't know of any d20 model that provides rules for that, not even with swords, arrows and lightening bolts.