Big Dark Sun hint

[Obryn]

good stuff

Huh! Great ideas!

-O

 

[Spatula]

The problem is, Dark Sun isn't points of light. Especially not how 4e does it.

4e is points of generic darkness surrounding points of really, really, really bright light. Adventurers start as being much better then everyone around them at everything, and go on to become super heroes. They fight villains in big, epic battles, and die gloriously in combat.

Dark Sun is points of grey surrounded by sand. Adventurers start as being kinda better then everyone around them at some things,

...except that they started at 3rd level, automatically had psionic wild talents (whereas NPCs were supposed to follow the normal rules for determining that), and could have up to 20s (or more with racial modifiers, which were twice the normal AD&D racial bonuses/penalties) in their abilities.

I don't think that DS is very well suited for an official 4e conversion, but it's definitely very points-of-lights-y, as are most published D&D settings.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

...except that they started at 3rd level, automatically had psionic wild talents (whereas NPCs were supposed to follow the normal rules for determining that), and could have up to 20s (or more with racial modifiers, which were twice the normal AD&D racial bonuses/penalties) in their abilities.

I don't think that DS is very well suited for an official 4e conversion, but it's definitely very points-of-lights-y, as are most published D&D settings.

you know back then you couldn't survive the setting as level 1 normal characters...now you could...

except that they started at 3rd level, automatically had psionic wild talents (whereas NPCs were supposed to follow the normal rules for determining that),

just like base 4e you are a cut above...just think a little and you could see this part as actualy inspired by DS...

 

[CelticMutt]

Within a year of the setting's release, the Prism Pentad series was written. This series killed off multiple sorcerer kings, killed the Dragon of Tyr (whose named turned out to be Borys, by the way), freed a city-state, and added a ridiculous back story to the setting. The latter wouldn't be so bad if the history wasn't so lousy and if a large portion of the setting's initial focus hadn't been on mystery in the first place.

If by ridiculous you mean ridiculously awesome, sure. How can you not love a backstory involving an ancient advanced fertile world destroyed by war and magic and humans bent on becoming god-kings, even if it meant genocidal war?

 

[illwizard]

I played Dark Sun once or twice as a junior but was too young to really appreciate any setting at that point. But I just checked out some of Brom's art and god it's awesome. I actually didn't realise how much I don't like the new Dnd art (although it's ok) until I saw some of his old stuff again.

 

[Henry]

If by ridiculous you mean ridiculously awesome, sure. How can you not love a backstory involving an ancient advanced fertile world destroyed by war and magic and humans bent on becoming god-kings, even if it meant genocidal war?

Except that the second boxed set pushed those themes to the back burner, and made the NPCs like Rikus, Sadira, the Avangions, etc. the focal characters. And the world wasn't nearly as "destroyed" as people thought...

"Oh, look, see that huge crack in the mountain range the earthquake opened up? Whole BUNCH of trees and water over there! And up north! Bunch of forest and Avangion guardians up there! And look, Tyr's a democracy now!"

It really took a lot of the fun stuff about the setting and sidelined it for things that mitigated it. Dark Sun was a setting that really could have benefitted from 4E's scheme of "small footprint settings." Establish it, fill out a few details, and then move on and don't screw with it any more.

Oh, and I'll add one more thing to the Dark Sun Conspiracy: Note that Psionics and Monks are coming out in the Player's Handbook 3 in 2010...

Plus, in a recent Tome show, I believe, was it James Wyatt, maybe, who talked about now that the core classes are out in the PH1 and PH2, that they have a little more room to experiment with some alternative classes and mechanics, a la the Psion - so maybe spheres and domains, or more appropriately "themed magic," might start getting some more love?

 

[boolean]

Really, the best solution is just to say that the divine power source lets you channel the power of the sorcerer kings, include some blanket mechanical tweaks to reflect that change, and come up with an elemental priest class.

Haven't there been statements that unlike Ki, the Elemental power source is still being worked on?

 

[Rechan]

Haven't there been statements that unlike Ki, the Elemental power source is still being worked on?

I talked to a WOtC guy about a month ago, and he said they haven't even started on the Elemental classes.

 

[vagabundo]

It really took a lot of the fun stuff about the setting and sidelined it for things that mitigated it. Dark Sun was a setting that really could have benefitted from 4E's scheme of "small footprint settings." Establish it, fill out a few details, and then move on and don't screw with it any more.

Agreed, give us some adventures that explore the setting as is and not move the time line. A few well placed dragon articles expanding on some of the core details and we're done.

It would take my group forever and a day to explore it in any detail. They are sooo slow...

 

[Silverblade The Ench]

Had 2nd 4th ed Dark Sun game on Saturday..hardly any fighting in it!

PCs were after folk who smashed up a brewery and kidnapped it's owner/family.
Party are young nobles, trying to prove themselves to their elders.

The brewery owner is a lady who's a "client" of the noble house and thus must be seen to be protected, and their house is not very violent (mostly farming, beer/wine is their business), folk are taking advantage of that so twins who head the house have had enough and want SERIOUS action

They wants the ones who did this crime publicly made to pay for it as a lesson.
Hey, it's Dark Sun, adventures are rarely "moral and high deeds of noble virtue", much more pragmatic stuff.

PCs tracked the miscreants down to some bully boys who had a gang who "supported" King Kalak
think oh, brown shirts in Germany, sort of a faction in the city with local gangs. Only logical really, supporting the sorceror king from real devotion, excuse to be a bully or whatever IMHO such groups or cults would be common. Folk LIKE power.

the gang's bar was suddenly over flowing with very good ale...rather than that "kank pee" they usually sold, so that tipped the party off

The gang's leader had a son, who was drunk as a skunk...rather than two PCs and 1 DM run PC get involved in deadly fight, the perty decided ot use cunning (very wise)

so they kidnapped the son, and were gonna demand the gang handed the brewer lady and her family be released, or...

well they were split between sending, ahem, parts to the gang leader as warning/proof (hearing yer cousin, who's a very nice guy in RL, arguing that the miscreant's "spherical" parts should be sent, was quite an eye opener!! )
or
sell him to ah, hm...slaver who dealt in male courtesans and eunuchs...

the bad guys tracked the party down though, hey, the room they'd rented, you think dives owned by folk in Tyr are not gonna rat you out for money?!

the ranger distracted the enemy with Blinding Bombs and a quick attack then ran away, rest of party escaped with the captive.
(IMHO, alchemy is perfect for Dark Sun, so party's avenger has ALchemy feat, hence poison, blinding bombs etc)

Ranger managed ot shake the gang of his heels after one bad guy got eaten by a mekillot...think a cross between a snapping turtle and a chameleon that's the size of a house...
*big, sticky, long tongue lashes out...yank...CHEW!*

so...party sells captive gang scuzzbag to aforementioned, ahem, specialist slave dealer, and bribes the merchant to sell the scuzzbag on a public auction

Party, ask the noble house leader to call the gang leader to their estate as part of the retribution
so he appears wondering what's going on, not knowing the House was involved

See what had happened was, his son,the kidnapped one, tried it on with the brewery owner woman, who smacked his lights out...he wanted revenge, said she'd insulted King Kalak, so his dad and the gang smashed the place up, took the beer and people, and sold the folk to slavers.
Very dumb thing to do to folk who are "protected".

So, the gang leader was given simple chice: sell his bar to the House, for funds ot buy his son and the brewery folk back form the slavers.
Or his son is off to a harem and he, the gang leader, would have a spectaculalrly bad hair day indeed....

Gang leader, duely chastened, meekly aquiesces, The pub is given to the brewery folk to recompense their hurts (and the noble house thus now has a pub of roughnecks under their influence...every bit helps!)

But it turned out bad for the gang leader, his son, after what he'd suffered under the slavers, had gone a bit nuts, and killed his dad! Blaming him for all that had happened, rather than his own venal self.

party is praised by their elders, one PC gets a magic item of his choice form the family vault...

*sings Red Dwarf song*
Fun fun in the sun, sun, sun!!