Blinding Barrage requires X magic weapons?

[Griogre]

I think the RAW on close blast with thrown magic weapons is ambiguous, and I’m waffling on how to rule this. It’s clear that with non magical weapons you need to throw a different weapon for each target:

…if you’re using thrown weapons, you need one for each target.

The issue is what happens with magic thrown weapons where it says:

Any magic light thrown or heavy thrown weapon, …, automatically returns to its wielder’s hand after a ranged attack with the weapon is resolved.

This is clear as mud, because who the heck knows when an attack is resolved? The terminology is very loose in the PH. It could mean after the throw or after the entire attack.

I think the situation is ambiguous enough I could rule either way, but I’m trying to go with the RAI here. So on one hand I don’t want to let the rogue throw his one vicious dagger up to nine times because that seems counter to the intention of the Close Blast rules for thrown weapons. On the other hand Blinding Barrage is a daily, while on the third hand Blinding *is* a pretty nasty condition.

Have I missed something? How many daggers do you think the rogue needs and why?

 

[Regicide]

When in doubt, give the players cake.

I've seen Xena Warrior Princess, and so did the game devs. Chakram of DOOOM anyone?

 

[Caliban]

Technically a close blast is not a ranged attack, so the rule about the magic dagger returning after a ranged attack doesn't apply.

That being said, I have yet to see a DM actually run it that way.

From what I've heard, it's generally been concluded that the intent is to treat it like a series of ranged attacks that don't provoke, and you only need one magical thrown weapon (it returns to your hand fast enough for you to throw it at the next target in the blast).

 

[CapnZapp]

Let me phrase it this way: If this power did require more than one magic weapon, how often do you think it'd be used? And how would you hold four or seven daggers in such a way as to get to use them all?

To me the intention is clear: the rogue should not have to carry more magical weapons than any other class (i.e. "about one").

The answer thus comes naturally: one dagger is enough. Let the rogue use his magic dagger against each and all targets in his daily.

Yes, this usage stretches credulity. But then again, so does a dozen other powers. Best not to mix believability and D&D, eh?

 

[Cadfan]

I'm pretty sure the intention is that you need one throwing weapon per target.

This isn't a problem if you're using shuriken, because they come enchanted in packs of five.

 

[Hypersmurf]

I'm pretty sure the intention is that you need one throwing weapon per target.

For what it's worth, the FAQ says this:
14. I am using a magical thrown weapon as part of an area of effect power. If I am attacking multiple enemies within that area, do I need multiple weapons, or will one suffice?

One is enough in this case. Magical thrown weapons return to you after each attack, so you’ll be able to use it against each enemy as part of using your power.

As Caliban notes, of course, this doesn't agree with what the rules say, but it's a point to throw in to the discussion.

-Hyp.

 

[Danceofmasks]

Hmm .. the shuriken thing could be tricky if they come in enchanted packs of 5.

I buy a pack of shuriken .. for the same price as a +1 weapon, and I hand 1 to each of my friends.
Do they all return to them?
How about if the pack has a daily power?

I guess it's fixable by deciding that you can't split the pack up, and the pack has one daily power in total.

 

[Caliban]

I don't see where it's stated that shurikens are enchanted in packs of 5.

It's not even stated that normal shurikens are sold in packs of 5. That "(5)" on the table could be a typo, because it's not clarified anywhere.

Personally, I consider mundane shurikens to be sold in sets of 5, but magical ones are a single shuriken that magically returns to you. YMMV

 

[Danceofmasks]

Well, so do I, but the weapon table could be read the other way, too.
Causes lots of problems, though .. so I doubt packs of 5 was the intent.

 

[CapnZapp]

Normal thrown weapons are sold in packs (=you get more than one for the price) just like ammo.

Enchanted thrown weapons are always sold individually. Otherwise the way to the cheese described by Danceofmasks lies wide open.

WotC really needs to issue errata along lines similar to this:

Thrown Weapons: Any magic thrown weapon, automatically returns to its wielder’s hand after each attack with the weapon is resolved, allowing the user to use it for all attacks granted by eligible powers (for which the weapon can be used), including all multi-target powers (such as blasts or area attacks).

Unless they do, there simply is no way to persuade those among you who believe otherwise this is the intent. Specifically, how the "throwing" auto-property only works for ranged attacks is an error that is especially urgent to fix.