Bluff as a free action.

[Hypersmurf]

What kind of thrower are you thinking about?
The one from desperado(sp) is the one that I always think of.

Watch the fight on the car again. When he jumps up on the roof and starts throwing knives through the sunroof - he pulls one from his bandolier and throws it; pulls another and throws it; pulls another and throws it.

That's Quickdraw in action.

The example you are using follows the format I gave above - throw-draw-throw-draw-throw-draw as a Full Attack Action.

-Hyp.

 

[Elvinis75]

Watch the fight on the car again. When he jumps up on the roof and starts throwing knives through the sunroof - he pulls one from his bandolier and throws it; pulls another and throws it; pulls another and throws it.

That's Quickdraw in action.

The example you are using follows the format I gave above - throw-draw-throw-draw-throw-draw as a Full Attack Action.

-Hyp.

And where are all the daggers that he is throwing coming from? The same spot. Not a stretch to see it working there. However, bluffing 4 times in different ways that fool even the best of fighters is going to take time. The rules are the same but the last part of the ruling is still the same. Common sense says no. DM decides. This DM says no way!

 

[Angcuru]

Maybe it's just me, but It seems that common sense it not all that common.

 

[Hypersmurf]

However, bluffing 4 times in different ways that fool even the best of fighters is going to take time.

Even so. Four standard actions for most people. Four MEAs for a Gladiator or someone with the Quicker than the Eye feat.

But the whole point of the Invisible Blade's class ability is that it allows him to feint as fast as it takes the guy from Desperado to Quickdraw a knife!

-Hyp.

 

[Elvinis75]

Even so. Four standard actions for most people. Four MEAs for a Gladiator or someone with the Quicker than the Eye feat.

But the whole point of the Invisible Blade's class ability is that it allows him to feint as fast as it takes the guy from Desperado to Quickdraw a knife!

-Hyp.

Does the PrC give an example of someone using it in that manner? If so then I'll buy the your claim for a dollar but lacking that I have to go by the rules and they point to it being a DM call.
Do you think that QD should let a fight draw and then drop every weapon that they have on their body as a free action? How many is too many free actions. My my guess is that after so many free actions a dm has to make a call and change it to a standard or move-equiv. Again it comes down to a DM call by the rules.

 

[Apok]

A thrown dagger is no different than a melee dagger in D&D.

How about this: quickdraw dagger, bluff, throw for sneak attack, quickdraw dagger, bluff, throw for sneak attack, quickdraw dagger, bluff, throw for sneak attack (assuming haste)

I can see this as abusable if the DM lets it be (doesn't limit free actions in a round).

Is it even possible to Feint a ranged attack? Granted, there's nothing in the rules that says you can't, but I typically don't associated Feint maneuvers w/ ranged attacks, though I suppose it's more plausible for daggers than arrows/bolts.

 

[Apok]

I think this is a bit overpowered. Here's why:

Rogue with Bluff and 2 attacks + a Speed dagger

BLUFF
SNEAK ATTACK
BLUFF
SNEAK ATTACK
BLUFF
SNEAK ATTACK

A.K.A. Sub-Nuke.

Now, Imagine if a dual-wielding Blackguard took the class (assuming that they can). At high enough levels you can get:

BLUFF
SNEAK ATTACK
BLUFF
SNEAK ATTACK
BLUFF
SNEAK ATTACK
BLUFF
SNEAK ATTACK
BLUFF
SNEAK ATTACK
BLUFF
SNEAK ATTACK

now if he has two Speed Kukris, tack on another two of those. FEAR PERFECT TWO-WEAPON FIGHTING muahahahahaaaaa.

it's too abusable, plain and simple.

You do realize that you can duplicate all this just by flanking your opponent, yes? No need for all those Bluff checks and it can be done at any level (though I have yet to see the game where a DM lets a low-level rogue dual-wield Speed Kukris...).

 

[Hypersmurf]

(though I have yet to see the game where a DM lets a low-level rogue dual-wield Speed Kukris...).

Note that the FAQ has declared two Weapons of Speed = one extra attack, not two...

-Hyp.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

You do realize that you can duplicate all this just by flanking your opponent, yes? No need for all those Bluff checks and it can be done at any level (though I have yet to see the game where a DM lets a low-level rogue dual-wield Speed Kukris...).

This is true, but to flank with a dagger, you need to be adjacent to your foe. That means vulnerable to that foe's countering full attack. With this ability, you can stand twenty feet away from your foe (2nd range increment, -2) and still sneak attack him on every hit of a full attack sequence.

So in essence, this ability seems to give a rogue the option of a ranged full attack with SA on every attack, at a penalty to attack depending on range increment and requiring the Quick Draw feat. It also partially negates the need for flanking, so long as your Bluff is maxed.

Not overpowered, I'd say, but definitely on the edge of it. It's pretty darned powerful, no doubt.

 

[Majoru Oakheart]

This is true, but to flank with a dagger, you need to be adjacent to your foe. That means vulnerable to that foe's countering full attack. With this ability, you can stand twenty feet away from your foe (2nd range increment, -2) and still sneak attack him on every hit of a full attack sequence.

So in essence, this ability seems to give a rogue the option of a ranged full attack with SA on every attack, at a penalty to attack depending on range increment and requiring the Quick Draw feat. It also partially negates the need for flanking, so long as your Bluff is maxed.

Not overpowered, I'd say, but definitely on the edge of it. It's pretty darned powerful, no doubt.

Yes, but with the wizard casting an improved invis on the rogue and using a bow you can basically already do the same thing.