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Body Counts?

Nifft

Penguin Herder
I dislike killing PCs, but I also dislike killing NPCs -- including bad guys. Sadly, due to the plots that my evil NPCs pursue, they often come into conflict with the PCs, and someone has to die.

I let the dice fall where they may, and mourn the dead on both sides, sacrificed to the greater glory of my Holy Plot.

-- N
 

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Truth Seeker

Adventurer
d4 said:
i've been GMing for around 18-19 years, and i've never killed a PC.

i don't think you need the threat of death hanging over the PCs in order to create dramatic tension, and i also don't think you need a lot of tension in order to enjoy the game. (it's supposed to be entertainment, not stressful.)

i also like to run my games like action movies. the hero in an action movie doesn't have to worry about dying when he's fighting some mooks or even the BBEG's henchmen. in my games, combat isn't there to be a tense, nerve-wracking time when the PCs don't know if they're going to live or die; combat is just another opportunity for the PCs to show how badass and cool they are.

as a player, i tend to get attached to my characters. my interest in the game takes a nosedive if he dies or if a lot of other PCs die. he stops being a person to me and becomes just a set of stats to be used in the next combat encounter. in order for me to fully invest in a character, i have to know he's going to be around for a while (for the whole campaign, ideally).
We share the same view...Bravo!
 

Christian Walker

First Post
Here's the kill stats in my current game....


Killed
109 human skeletons
34 human zombies
26 human commoners lvl. 1
16 skeletal wolves
11 human warriors lvl. 1
02 skeletal horses
01 human fighter lvl. 2
01 human wizard lvl. 1
01 wraith


Captured
06 human commoners lvl. 1
05 human warriors lvl. 1
01 human fighter lvl. 4

Driven Off
06 human commoner lvl. 1
01 human fighter lvl. 2

PC Deaths
Sir Aleen, Chaplain of Iridia (Ftr 2/Clr 2) - Fell in hand to hand combat with Lord Crase.

Epicurus (Ftr2/Rgr2) - Slain by Sir Aleen after a dispute over looting.

Kerrick (Ftr1) - Killed by a skeletal archer in Teague.

Aerival (Sor3) - Returned to the elven lands to get away from all the filthy humans.
 

Blue_Kryptonite

First Post
Because I'm bored and tired and my wife is in the shower, I'll repeat my answer from the other thread. :D

Doctor Anomalous said:
Death only happens by consent, much like on a MUX. I treat my campaign like a weekly fantasy adventure tv series, and most series don't casually kill off their main characters. Although I don't watch Angekl, my son does, and Doyle dying would be an excuse, and the player's choice, so he could then play Wesley. If a character does die in this fashion, there's usually something that removes the corpse, or its an emotional role-play scene including background music. New characters are introduced at the same level as the others, and owing me a paragraph of background and plot hooks, including vauge lists of achievements, per level.
 

caudor

Adventurer
I tend to play more as a referee and let the dice determine the player's fate.

However, I do adjust the adventures to accomodate the game-maturity of the players. I have a group of young boys I DM for occasionally. The thrill for them is just getting to play, so I usually bump the encounter levels down a bit when they play just so they have a good chance of completing the adventure before they go back home. I'd hate to see one of these boys sitting out early on.

On the other hand, a member of my regular group does not get a handicap adjustment.
 

NiTessine

Explorer
I read the dice as they fall, and if the dice say the PC dies... the PC dies. I prefer this style, and my players haven't been complaining, even after the 19 PC deaths of the last campaign. Most of them were directly attributable to bad tactics.
 

Norfleet

First Post
I run the meatgrinder: Combat is exceedingly lethal, and generally when breaking in a new group, I can kill about 80 characters in one night, often within seconds of entering the LZ. First level characters are entirely expendable. An actual TPK is somewhat less common, and only happens if the entire group is stupid, but in a fight, people invariably die, and I tend to run death as a somewhat more permanent deal. I'm one of the people who inspired part of that "Killer DM" list.
 

caudor

Adventurer
Norfleet said:
I'm one of the people who inspired part of that "Killer DM" list.

Sounds like you might have inspired a Captain Crunch commercial as well :p You can't beat the crunch because the crunch always gives you away. Killer DM, yep...definately.
 

Capellan

Explorer
Hmm, this could be a long response :)

First, as a player, I usually do everything I can to keep my characters alive. I plan ahead, I make contingencies, I keep escape routes open, and if at all possible, I tilt the odds in my favour in every battle I can. I've generally been pretty successful with this approach: I do sometimes lose characters, but at a comparatively slow rate.

All that said, despite my aversion to character death, as a player I want to know that the possibility exists. Survival needs to be a challenge, and something to be worked toward, for it to have value to me. Why is this? Well, oddly enough, it's because I don't particularly enjoy combat :)

I can roleplay with or without danger to my characters, and derive a lot of enjoyment from doing so. Portraying the awkward homecoming of my Dwarf Wizard ("why couldn't he have a respectable job, like mining?") is fun for me, in and of itself.

When we get into combat, on the other hand, I need it to be more than just a bunch of dice-rolling, or I won't be interested. I need the intellectual challenge of "how do I stay alive and beat the enemy as effectively as possible?". Fortunately, the d20 combat system is flexible enough to make this an interesting challenge.

I'm curious - of the people who don't like character death, do you do use the full combat system, or cut it down somehow? If I were forced to sit around rolling dice for an hour in a combat I knew couldn't kill me, I'd get bored.

An aside - I don't know how common it is in the US, but a lot of convention games in Australia have an option of playing them in 'cinematic' style, which means that you chuck out the rules system and run by GM fiat. This turns combat into another form of roleplay, as you describe your actions and the GM rules on the fly whether it work. It can be quite successful, if done well. Some people use it in their home games, too.

As a GM, I generally tend to kill people only where:
- they make foolish and dangerous decisions; or
- I've clearly flagged the encounter as one of significant danger, beforehand

For instance, let's say I'm running a game and two of the encounters are a skirmish with some Orcish raiders (a minor reminder to the PCs that there is a looming war with the Orcs) and an encounter with a necromancer the PCs have been tracking for three sessions, and whose handiwork they have seen several times before. They know the necromancer travels with a pack of ghouls.

In the former encounter, I'd play the orcs in a disorganised, but not entirely stupid, fashion. They're loud, brash and direct, but they aren't just cannon-fodder. Still, as long as the PCs don't do anything stupid, they'll just take a few lumps - no deaths.

On the other hand, when they meet the necromancer and his ghouls, they'd better have a good plan, and suitable preparation, or someone will be undead chow. This is an encounter that's been building for several sessions, and I've given them some specific information about their foe. Failing to use that information, and to make ready for the upcoming battle, will lead to character death.

So my basic position is: the threat of death should be real - particularly in 'major' encounters - but proper planning and care should mitigate and reduce (though never entirely eliminate) the possibility.
 

S'mon

Legend
I've had 6 dead PCs and 1 dead cohort in the last 3 sessions, an above average death rate for my game (current campaign has been running nearly 2 years). All permanently dead but one PC who was raised minus all their gear, PC left game. Party level is 11th-13th.

In the first session, I was running Necropolis and party was attacked by 4 CR 14 Hippodilemons who dragged 2 PCs into the water and shook them until they died.

In the second & third session, PCs were going up against a CR 20 BBEG who consistently outsmarted and outfought them.

Survivors are now licking their wounds.
 

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