Originally posted by OrigamiCommando
I and a fellow DM got the BoED a while back and a debate immediately began between our group about the feat Vow of Poverty. Is it balanced or is it overpowered? We have an especially large group of people playing and we decided to test these feats, the Vows (esp. the poverty one) by playing with them under different circumstances. Ripping an adventure offline, my fellow DM who owns the book has decided to run our now 4 person group through it. The testing party:
Cleric of Lastai - CG - Half-Orc - Me
Fighter - CG - Elf
Rogue - NG - Halfling
Monk - LG - Human
The following is, basically, a personal diary which will be updated by me and the three others in the group who will be testing the Vows. We will keep it short and informative, if we can. We start the diaries at level 3 as that is the earliest Non-Humans can get the feat. We will do them by 5 level intervals. Below we have it set up to level 10. Without further ado, let's get this show on the road.
Level 3 - 5
Monk - So far, I'm liking my character's AC. The extra Feats, though nice, kind of suck generally. The Vow of Peace Combo with the Vow of Poverty seems kind of broken. Might just be me though.
Most Memorable Moment: Almost dying of thirst in the desert because I'm not allowed to own a waterskin.
Current Feats: Sacred Vow, Vow of Poverty, Improved Grapple, Vow of Nonviolence, Deflect Arrows, Catch Arrows, Vow of Peace
Fighter - I am attempting my favorite 2 weapon build with a fighter. Normally I'd take a double axe or double sword but seeing as how I have to use pansy simple weapons, quarterstaff is fine. Not bad so far. Unlike the guy playing the monk, I can make my saves so it's been smooth sailing, as far as starving and thirst. My issues are with the fighter: I used Dex as my secondary dumpstat (only put 15 in it) and didn't realize I couldn't use armor. My AC is incredibly low, like 3 points below 20.
Most Memorable Moment: Having to jump behing the rogue in combat because I was almost killed by a couple of zombies . And I thought I was supposed to be the meat shield.
Current Feats: Sacred Vow, Weapon Focus (Quarter Staff - Duh), Two Weapon Fighting, Vow of Poverty, Weapon Specialization (Quarterstaff), Nimbus of Light
Rogue - I, personally, do not like this feat all that much. It definitely was not made with rogues in mind, in my opinion. The AC bonus is a nice boon, but I miss being able to use magic items or even scrolls. They have totally rendered Use Magic Device worthless.
Most Memorable Moment: Capturing and trying to convert a brood of marauding kobolds. It was fun trying to figure out how to keep 12 kobolds from escaping while trying to treat them humanely without the use of shackles. It is the first time the Use Rope check came into effect in that important of a scope, as well as using my few ranks in Survival to scrounge up the vines to use as rope since I can't buy that either.
Current Feats: Sacred Vow, Vow of Poverty, Vow of Chastity
Cleric - Hooah! And I'll form The Cleric! Unfortunately, only after choosing my deity did I come to realize a fatal flaw: my deities favored weapon is martial, not simple. Curses. Oh well, a club is good enough for me. Most my really useful spells don't have expensive material components or focuses. The real downside is that I can't turn undead, because holy symbols aren't among the items listed under Vow of Poverty that a character can hang on to. I wonder if I could just use an actual peach, instead of a symbol of one.
Most Memorable Moment: I'll agree with the monk and the rogue together. I have never almost died of thirst in a game before so it would be the first time I've used that rule. The kobold situation was an interesting one. Only the sorcerer kobold presented me with a serious diplomatic challenge in conversion.
Current Feats: Sacred Vow, Vow of Poverty, Vow of Abstinence
Level 6 - 10
Monk - Well, we got to fight our first evil outsiders. That was fun. So far the party has been alright, although when they tried to turn the fighter against us, that was very nearly a TPK. At least I'm not starving to death and dying of thirst any more.
Most Memorable Moment: When we fought the Warrior of Darkness from the BoVD. He was a vampire, to make things even worse.
Current Feats: Sacred Vow, Vow of Poverty, Improved Grapple, Vow of Nonviolence, Deflect Arrows, Catch Arrows, Vow of Peace, Improved Trip, Holy Subdual, Power Attack, Gift of Faith, Improved Sunder, Sactify Ki Strike
Fighter - Quarterstaff isn't such a bad weapon. I'd prefer a double sword but then, I guess that's the point of the feat, right? Downside was we got offtrack and had to quest for an Atonement around level 9 because some wizard cast Morality Undone against me and screwed half my feats in the process. Oh well, never pass up on a chance for XP. Despite this setback, my two weapon build works reasonably well, and I'm becoming pretty scary for a hobo with a stick.
Most Memorable Moment: Becoming a renowned hero and becoming known as a protector of children due to how I handled a hostage situation earlier on. It's actually refreshing to play a true blue goody two shoes for a change.
Current Feats: Sacred Vow, Weapon Focus (Quarter Staff - Duh), Two Weapon Fighting, Vow of Poverty, Weapon Specialization (Quarterstaff), Nimbus of Light, Sanctify Martial Strike, Improved Two Weapon Fighting, Kiss of the Nymph (or Nixie, in my case), Greater Weapon Focus, Subduing Strike, Power Attack, Cleave, Stigmata
Rogue - I'm certainly learning to deal with this change of pace better now. I have become adept at losing my dagger on a regular basis, due to it being my only ranged weapon choice, but luckily, the DM doesn't use the ammo rules so we always find it. I sure wish I could have flown or walked on walls in that last labrynth we went through: Nothing but chasms, crags, and traps involving falling.
Most Memorable Moment: Realizing that there was an exalted feat made specially for rogues called Sacred Strike at about 8th level when it would have been immensely useful before that. Thanks alot for pointing that out guys. :rollseyes:
Current Feats: Sacred Vow, Vow of Poverty, Vow of Chastity, Subduing Strike, Dodge, Sacred Strike, Mobility, Holy Subdual
Cleric - No more worrying about spell components or where the hell I might go to find peach seeds in the desert. I'd almost forgotten about Eschew Materials. These extra spell power up feats it grants are actually pretty decent to boot. I'm starting to like the Vow of Poverty. What I have found is, though marginally more powerful than folks at our level, I do miss the versatility of being able to trade out one peice of gear for another. You really do take flight and spider climb for granted at later levels until you no longer have them.
Most Memorable Moment: Actually having to make climb checks after level 8 to get to the manor of the vampire mentioned by the monk. Not fun, especially without climbing gear.
Current Feats: Sacred Vow, Vow of Poverty, Vow of Abstinence, Purify Spell, Non-Lethal Substitution, Eschew Materials, Spell Focus (Good), Subduing Strike
Feel free to leave your opinions. I'll get back to this in a week with levels 11 - 15 if all goes well. I'll edit this post and put it in later.
