bonus spells for high modifiers, but limited spell levels

[Bad Paper]

What if a 20th level paladin or ranger has a Wisdom score of 20? He gets two bonus 1st level spells, one bonus 2nd, one bonus 3rd, one bonus 4th, and...he "should" get one bonus 5th, but there aren't any 5th level paladin spells. Can he apply that 5th-level bonus to a 4th level spell? Can he memorize a metamagicked spell in that 5th level slot? Does he lose it?

Same, I suppose, with the 20th level bard with a Charisma of 24. But since bards are spontaneous casters, there is also the option of metamagicking up a spell on the fly into that 7th level slot, or taking that preparation feat from Complete Arcane that would let him store it there. Or does he lose it?

 

[Mouseferatu]

Nope. The paladin simply doesn't get bonus slots above 4th, because he doesn't have any casting ability above 4th.

 

[Sound of Azure]

Unfortunately, By the RAW those slots are "lost", since you only can get bonus spells for spell levels your class actually has.

Your example paladin, no matter how high his starting Wisdom, would be unable to "cash in" his bonus 2nd level spell slots until he hits level 8, when his 2nd-level slot numbers change from "-" to "0" on the spells per day chart. A paladin cannot have 5th level slots (they are effectively a "-") until he hits epic levels, and then only if he takes the Improved Spell Capacity feat.

You could implement that house rule if you wanted, but I'd guess the players of Clerics, Druids, Sorcerers, and Wizards will be even happier with such a house rule.

 

[Arkhandus]

Not really, doesn't make sense.

And by that logic, a 1st-level wizard with 18 Intelligence should be applying his bonus 2nd, 3rd, and 4th-level slots for use with his 1st-level spells, seeing as he can't actually cast those levels of spells yet..... See where it leads?

Besides, if they reach epic levels and take the appropriate feat, they'll start to accumulate slots of levels above 4th or 6th, and then those extra slots from high Wisdom or whatever will apply.

 

[TessarrianDM]

Due to a misinterpretation of the rules when 3.0 came out (a failure to read far enough), I have always allowed spellcasters to use bonus slots granted by high scores to fill those slots with lower level spells, even if they could not cast spells of the bonus slot level. While this can greatly increase the casting ability of a low-level spellcaster with a high score, it has not affected our game enough to go back and follow RAW. Keep in mind that I use the same rule for NPC spellcasters, so that tends to balance it out. I do not, however, allow them to use a metamagicked spell to fill that slot (e.g., if the highest level spell they can cast is 4th, and they have a 5th level bonus slot, they cannot fill it with a Silent 4th level spell). The bonus slots are treated as if they were of the highest level the character can cast.

So, while it is not RAW, it is not as unbalanced as it may seem in our experience.

 

[Arkhandus]

What? Wizards who can Fireball or Scorching Ray an extra few times per day don't outshine fighters more than normal in your game? Wierd.

 

[sdt]

I think it is a good house rule - it gives the low level wizards a few more spells to cast before they start hitting party members with stray crossbow bolts.

 

[TessarrianDM]

No, not really. Four of the nine PC's are full-blown casters, one of whom is a Healer. Two have some casting ability (a ranger and a paladin). The others are a monk, fighter, and fighter/rogue. Usually the fighter/rogue and monk encounter an enemy first in their positions as scouts. Once alerted, the paladin and fighter charge into battle while the ranger serves as fire support and protection for the healer and two mystic theurges. With allies in melee, the spellcasters tend to shy away from area effect spells, instead concentrating on targeted spells and party buff/protection. Oftentimes, they rely on wands for the lower-level area effect spells anyway. We seem to have an unusually balanced game in that our non-spellcasting characters rarely feel as if they are not getting enough glory, and are definitely not outshined by the spellcasters.

 

[Arkhandus]

Ah, well there's part of the reason why. Your casters don't nuke stuff because the other party members rush into danger first. Though I'm sure the casters could nuke the enemy well enough without everyone else rushing in to get beaten up a little.

 

[Quartz]

If the paladin takes the appropriate Epic feat at 21st level, he'll be able to cast 5th level spells and so can use that slot for lower-level spells or metamagiced lower level spells.