Book of Vile Darkness

[Sammael99]

Man, there's too much free porn on the internet for me to use an expensive gaming book as masturbatory material and risk getting it all messed up. (I learned that lesson with some of my high school yearbooks.)

Sheesh. You've got to think practically about these things.

What do you know, some people just HAVE to mesh their hobbies...

Wolfspider, that's the most sensible reply to this whole ridiculous "scandal" !

 

[Wolfen Priest]

ANYway...

Back to the actual subject material of this book (i.e., not porn)...

My little nephew who takes after me and is only 9 and a half, is literally counting the days until he turns 12, when I told him I would teach him to play D&D. I figure since he is that excited, I'll probably cave and teach him sooner.

Now I know for a fact that his mom, my sister, would not let him play D&D at all if she even knew that a book was coming out about selling one's soul, dark pacts with demons, human sacrifice, drug addiction, etc.

I'm glad the book is coming out and I will probably buy it; but, do I think WotC is making the right decision in releasing this book to the public? Nope. I always figured this kind of thing would be better tackled by a 3rd party; heck, Monte could still write the dang-blasted thing to keep everyone happy.

I just really hope they keep the release of this product nice and quiet, otherwise my nephew won't be learning to play D&D.

 

[Wolfspider]

Now I know for a fact that his mom, my sister, would not let him play D&D at all if she even knew that a book was coming out about selling one's soul, dark pacts with demons, human sacrifice, drug addiction, etc.

Would his parents really care if this book was published by WotC or some other d20 publisher? I think all they would care about would be the fact that it was a D&D book (because that would probably be the extent of their understanding of the entire OGL/D20 business).

I think that it may actually be better if WotC DOES publish a book of this kind first, so they can set a (hopefully tasteful) precedent for the rest of the industry to follow concerning the description of such evils.

 

[JeffB]

I don't plan on getting BoVD myself...I don't find much of the purported subject matter interesting or useful for my games..

However, Im really curious why people want rules for these sorts of things. Rules for selling your soul? For sacrifice? (what, does the evil cultist score an automatic crit because the victim is bound? what kind of rules are needed here?) I could see rules for drugs themselves, but not drug-use...Ok...make your will save..Oh no..your addicted!How hard is that to figure out? Do the demon lords/princes show up enough in people's games that they need to know what there BAB cross clas skills and AC are? Are your players fighting these guys?

IMO a book that detailed the organization of the Demon Princes and Devils, ie. their lackeys and dogma would be much more useful;not rules related issues..again unless some sort of combat was involved...

And I'm serious here...I just don't understand why one would need RULES for these things...

On the other hand I feel the Kalamar book would be a much better DM resource...and I do plan on getting it

 

[Ristamar]

Teh b00|< oF V1L3 pr0n o\/\/Nz j00!

*cough*

Yeah, anyway... considering the author and publisher, I'm pretty sure I'll find plenty of stuff both useful interesting in this upcoming release. The potential for cool feats and/or prestige classes is off the charts. I can even imagine characters selling their souls (or other services) for additional powers, only to have the denizens of hell come to forcefully collect later down the road. As for gaining power via sacrifice/rituals, heck, that's been a staple of fantasy for centuries. Obviously this is primarily a DM's sourcebook, though I could see it being used now and then by players in less 'heroic' campaigns.

The sort of evil alluded to by the credible previews of BoVD has permeated throughout a myriad of adventures and campaigns since the birth of D&D. It's just never had a published set of rules* to govern it. All I can say is... It's about frickin' time.

*I've heard there were certain 1e materials dealing with sacrifice and other 'vile' acts and were considered highly controversial, but I've never had a chance to see them.

 

[Wolfspider]

However, Im really curious why people want rules for these sorts of things. Rules for selling your soul? For sacrifice? (what, does the evil cultist score an automatic crit because the victim is bound? what kind of rules are needed here?)

I think you're being facetious here. These kinds of rules would not necessarily detail HOW you sacrifice someone but what the benefits of such sacrifice are. Why exactly does that necromancer want to sacrifice so many virgins? What's in it for him? What powers and benefits do you get from willingingly damning yourself? There must be some tangible benefit or else villians wouldn't do it.

Do the demon lords/princes show up enough in people's games that they need to know what there BAB cross clas skills and AC are? Are your players fighting these guys?

Well, yes, actually. Demon princess and lords like Orcus and Lolth are CLASSIC D&D villians. Characters in my campaigns have fought the likes of these two countless times...both battling to foil their schemes (at lower levels) and actually confronting the vile beings themselves (at higher level).

 

[Sammael99]

However, Im really curious why people want rules for these sorts of things. Rules for selling your soul? For sacrifice? (what, does the evil cultist score an automatic crit because the victim is bound? what kind of rules are needed here?) I could see rules for drugs themselves, but not drug-use...Ok...make your will save..Oh no..your addicted!How hard is that to figure out? Do the demon lords/princes show up enough in people's games that they need to know what there BAB cross clas skills and AC are? Are your players fighting these guys?

Let me explain what I expect from the book (whether it is actually what I get or not is another matter entirely...)

On the subject of sacrifices, for example : I like villains who do sacrifices. Well, like is not the word. I find them interesting antagonists for the PCs. First of all beacuse it's vile. Second because it usually puts the PCs in situations and confrontations when they need to wipe out some participants while protecting others. Always more interesting than a straight-ahead fight.

Now in the actual D&D rules, there is no need and no gain from sacrificing anyone to your deity. So why would evil cults do it ? Why would mad wizards do it ?

Similarly, NPCs who make pacts with evil entities are a classic of RPGing. What are the mechanics for this ? It would be nice to know.

In my current campaign, the PCs will be confronted to a resurgence of an evil devil cult. I think if the book is done well, I might pick quite a few ideas from this.

Now you may be right in saying that DMs could invent these things themselves. I agree with this, but DMs could design their monsters, game worlds, PrCs and everything else as well. WHy do we need these rules ? Because we're too lazy to design them ourselves, and because it's nice to have a common set of rules for elements that may appear relatively frequently in RPG plots.

As for the arch-devils and arch-demons stats, you might as well ask : why did they releases "Deities and Demigods". I myself didn't get it because I have no need for stats of gods. Similarly, I have no need for stats of arch-ds. But then again, there's much stuff in most RPG books I purchase that I don't need...

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

Push that envelope Monte!!!! I hope I have to make a fright check when I hopen the book. Since I could care less what little Bobby's mom thinks of the book, I'm hoping it's pushing the envelope of good taste.

Whey do people say idiotic stuff like, "Monte has a unhealthy facination with this material..."? Are horror authors sick twisted men becuase they write morbid tales of horror and evil? Please...

 

[Hakkenshi]

Do the demon lords/princes show up enough in people's games that they need to know what there BAB cross clas skills and AC are? Are your players fighting these guys?

You mean my 6-7 PC party of level 23+ characters? Yep, definitely.

So the book is multi-purpose; it also has epic-level support. Is this a BAD thing somehow? I think that having books cover a wider range of challenges and encounters can only be a positive change.

 

[Tsyr]

Are horror authors sick twisted men becuase they write morbid tales of horror and evil? Please...

Sick? Probably not. Twisted? Hell yes. How else do you explain Lovecraft?