C&Ds for Online D&D 5E Character Generators

Ed Friedlander reports that WotC has asked him to remove his D&D character generators. Ed ran the generators at his site, Pathguy.com, including a D&D 5E character generator. His Pathfinder RPG character generator is still running. Thanks to Slayyne for the scoop (who also reports that at least one other site has also closed). [Update: while the actual request has not been shared, others have reported that these are very amicable requests].

You can see his closing note here.

"After almost two decades, Wizards of the Coast has asked me to remove my online character generators. I appreciate the many people who have written and thanked me for my work, and I hope you will continue to enjoy the hobby.

As a physician and gamer, I've supported and defended the hobby, and helped concerned families understand its value.

The "Dungeons and Dragons" phenomenon has encouraged young people to study other cultures. It is a game in which people work together to accomplish a meaningful goal. Characters even define themselves in terms of their good morals and their ethics. On one level, it simulates the spiritual warfare described in the Christian scriptures and in the Arthurian legends on which the game is based. I am proud that I was able to make a contribution.

My generator for Pathfinder will of course remain online. Click here for more information about this role-playing game.

May your dice come up 20s.

Ed Friedlander MD"

Back in November, the D&D Tools website suffered a similar fate, as have a couple of spellcard websites. While WotC appears to be largely easygoing as far as fan creations are concerned, they do take action when content from their products is copied or distributed.

Ed's character generator created characters by selecting a number of options, and output a character sheet similar to below. I'm not all that familiar with it, so I don't know what text, if any, it may have borrowed from the official rules.

As yet, there's no license (Open Gaming or otherwise) for D&D 5th Edition (although WotC does intend to do so), although a number of publishers have published books anyway using the older Open Gaming License for D&D 3E and 3.5.

What is interesting to hear is that some people who have received such requests describe them as very amicable. Toxic Rat says "Speaking from personal experience, I received a very nice email asking that I take down particular content owned by WotC. No threats, no warnings of legal action, just a request to honor their copyright." That's great to hear.

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[JediSoth]

Oh bother. I was using those generators to create NPCs/Hirelings quickly.

 

[Reynard]

If the sample character in the OP is an accurate representation of what the tool provides, then something is amiss - as we know game mechanics can't be protected by copyright (only the specific expression of them), and there's nothing else there. That suggests to me that the tool must have provided more - probably write-ups for the various selected powers/backgrounds/race selections/etc. In which case, WotC are indeed right to take action.

I used the generator for convention pre-gens. The material shown is representative. There are no blocks of copyrighted text. This is WotC pretending it is 1999.

 

[Bugleyman]

As stated in previous posts I think ultimately that people will eventually drift to other games, despite how good this one is.

That is precisely what will happen if they don't change direction right quick. Unfortunately, they seem determined to party like it's 1999.

The fact that 5E is such a good game just makes it that much more painful to watch.

 

[Reynard]

That is precisely what will happen if they don't change direction right quick. Unfortunately, they seem determined to party like it's 1999.

The fact that 5E is such a good game just makes it that much more painful to watch.

Also, it seems incomprehensible that they can look at the success of Pathfinder, which gives away all of its game mechanics almost as quickly as they are published and in an accessible and user friendly format, and somehow think OGLing 5E would have a negative impact on the success of 5E.

 

[Bugleyman]

Also, it seems incomprehensible that they can look at the success of Pathfinder, which gives away all of its game mechanics almost as quickly as they are published and in an accessible and user friendly format, and somehow think OGLing 5E would have a negative impact on the success of 5E.

This is usually the part where someone says "but WotC has more information than some random guy on the Internet. They must know what they're doing!" Yeah, well I watched them "information" 4E into an early grave...an exercise they seem hell-bent on repeating with 5E.

Fixing it would be simple and fast:

1. OGL 5E.
2. License Lone Wolf (with very modest fees) to do an a 5E package for Hero Lab.
3. Release 5E PDFs on D&DClassics.com.

Then just get out of the way. The game would absolutely thrive, because they have a fantastic product and a superior brand.

Like I said, painful to watch.

 

[Pauper]

Guys, it's really not that complex.

Gale Force 9 has a license from WotC to produce spell cards. Someone at GF9 notices a few free online spell-card generators and sends a note to WotC asking why they're paying a license fee when other folks are using the same material for free. WotC sends out friendly, 'please respect our copyright' notices.

Lone Wolf gets into discussions with WotC about licensing the Fifth Edition rules set so that Lone Wolf can produce a module for HeroLab. WotC quotes a license figure, and Lone Wolf responds that the number seems a bit steep when others are producing character generators online without paying a dime. WotC sends out friendly 'please respect our copyright' notices.

Homebrew settings, houserule mechanics, those things are fair game and part of the way in which the fans 'own' D&D. But WotC actually owns D&D, so publishing your 'homebrew' module "The Schmemple of Schmelemental Schmevil" is probably going to draw some attention.

 

[Bugleyman]

Guys, it's really not that complex.

On that, at least, we agree.

Gale Force 9 has a license from WotC to produce spell cards. Someone at GF9 notices a few free online spell-card generators and sends a note to WotC asking why they're paying a license fee when other folks are using the same material for free. WotC sends out friendly, 'please respect our copyright' notices.

Lone Wolf gets into discussions with WotC about licensing the Fifth Edition rules set so that Lone Wolf can produce a module for HeroLab. WotC quotes a license figure, and Lone Wolf responds that the number seems a bit steep when others are producing character generators online without paying a dime. WotC sends out friendly 'please respect our copyright' notices.

Homebrew settings, houserule mechanics, those things are fair game and part of the way in which the fans 'own' D&D. But WotC actually owns D&D, so publishing your 'homebrew' module "The Schmemple of Schmelemental Schmevil" is probably going to draw some attention.

And meanwhile the months roll by with NO tools, NO PDFs, and NO digital options. If they're not careful, they're going to "protect" 5E into an early grave.

 

[rbiddle]

Again though, theres the bigger problem of us fans not knowing what and what will not get shut down except through arcane guess work. Wizards has every right of shutting anyone down, it's their IP and they can do with it as they wish. Now clearly a game that ENCOURAGES people to take it and make it their own seems to be a bit... contradictory. From they very first day of the launch of the Starter Set back in the summer they should have had a fan use policy. That's one of the first things any competent company does. Take numenera for example, as soon as the game was released they laid out the rules.

If they keep their IP close to them and no one else then you will eventually start loosing fans. Granted Wizards are not that bad yet, but they are starting on that path to be sure. As much as I love D&D, Wizards have abysmal PR. We rarely get any information about the future and their business plans. Of course this leads into their release schedule nonsense. Anyway, the point is they won't tell us anything until it's too late! God, it's so annoying.

There's an easy way to know what will or will not get shut down without any magic divination or arcane guessing... The developer can email the company and let them know what they are doing and either get their permission to use their IP or be told up front, that it won't be allowed. I got in a bit of hot water with Chaosium for not asking before I made a Call of Cthulhu item, but we talked since and we're on good grounds (and I officially got permission to use some of their IP). I should have asked first and might have actually gotten better support while I was in development still.

Asking WoTC would just take an email to find out if they would or would not issue a C&D.

 

[Zaran]

When it comes to WotC and stuff to do on the computer, there just is no mixing. They have a clunky website that they barely use. They constantly choose terrible partners for online content. They think internet piracy is why 4e didn't sell. and they think Neverwinter Online is the bee's knees. I really don't think it will get better.

 

[Dausuul]

As far as I know, you can not claim IP on a game's mechanics, so don't know why they could ask to pull this down.

Mechanics are mostly, kinda, non-copyrightable, but you certainly can copyright the presentation of those mechanics. That means you have to rewrite everything in your own words. Given 5E's "natural language" approach, that requires quite a bit of work, and could lead to discrepancies if your interpretation differs from someone else's.

I don't have a problem with WotC enforcing their copyright. I do wish they would hurry up and tell us what they have in mind around licensing. From what I've seen, the sense of the community right now is that at least part of 5E is slated to be OGL-ed, based on comments by (I think) Chris Perkins. Those comments are a few months old now, however, and we've heard nothing more since.