D&D 4E Call a kender a kender? What should 4E "halflings" be called?

What should WotC call 4E "halflings"


Wolfspider said:
This isn't World of Darkness: Gypsies, after all.

God, this book was so incredibly racist. When it was released my FLGS ordered a few copies, then the owner flipped through the book and removed it from the shelves because he didn't want to sell trash like that.
 

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Cam Banks said:
No, they aren't. Nothing in their racial write-up holds with your contention that they are designed as party-ruining pilferers.

Possibly not in 3e, granted. But from what I recall from the first two trilogies- which I loved, btw- and the 1e gaming material that I looked at (the hardback, the early modules, etc), the idea that kender ought to be innocently picking stuff up from other pcs all the time was put forward pretty strongly.

Really, my biggest exposure to kenders was via a bunch of players who all wanted to be the obnoxious, pick your pal's pocket and get away with it type of character. Maybe you're right and it was a problem with all those players (I would estimate a good 12-15 different players); but certainly, at least the early DL novels and game books really pushed this kind of behavior as kender-appropriate.

My point is that most people with some level of exposure to DL, possibly excepting hard-core DL gamers, are likely to play a "kender" in a very different, and ime very annoying, manner than they will play a "halfling", even if they have almost identical racial write-ups. And the stereotypical kender character is the kind of pc that drives most other players mad. So while I will gracefully admit that you're prolly much more learned about the ins and outs of kender than I am, I will stand by my comments as well.

Edit: And all those kender players ranged from high school age to 40something fatbeards. I actually can only recall one time when I saw a kender in-game who didn't cause problems for the party. Granted, most of the time these were one-shots, tourney games or very short-lived groups, but still.
 

I think merging gnomes and halflings is an unrealistic idea. Both races have their fans, and expecting those fans to accept that kind of change... It just isnt going to happen.

I think a lot of people play halflings to play them as rogues. Its as simple as that. 2e halflings (essentially hobbits) had the problem of being total layabouts that had no reason to adventure, just like tolkien's hobbits. Remember, Bilbo and Frodo were "queer" to other hobbits.

3e took the hobbit out of the halfling and reinvented it. You could already feel a little bit of kender in the 3e halfling, and I bet if you were to go back to the 3e announcement threads you would see one just like this.

But I think there are enough things to make the halfling different than the kender. The trade and diplomacy aspect of these halflings keep them from going off the deep end into total kleptomania.
 

Whizbang Dustyboots said:
It is WoD: Gypsy all over again. Unfortunately, the Roma are such a small ethnic group in America that most players either think they're fictional or it doesn't occur to them that they're being sold racist pap.
I agree that the second pic can be seen that way, but how is the first one a negative stereotype? She looks quite lovely, and it's a nice day with birds in the sky.
 


Fifth Element said:
I agree that the second pic can be seen that way, but how is the first one a negative stereotype? She looks quite lovely, and it's a nice day with birds in the sky.
It's not a negative pic, it's just me refuting that anyone had to read in "halfling = gypsy" in 3E. If the art director didn't tell the artist "give me a short gypsy woman by a short gypsy wagon," I'll eat a bug.
 

Hairfoot said:
"Elfling" would have been appropriate from 3E onward. Hobbit-halflings were small humans, kender halflings are small elves. They should have formalised the connection.

My wish for 4E was that the race set up would be bigs/smalls of four races: human/hobbit, elf/kender, dwarf/gnome and hobgoblin/goblin.

Such symmetry annoys me. It's not as if there are giant moose to correspond to regular moose as whales correspond to porpoises.
 


Whizbang Dustyboots said:
It's not a negative pic, it's just me refuting that anyone had to read in "halfling = gypsy" in 3E. If the art director didn't tell the artist "give me a short gypsy woman by a short gypsy wagon," I'll eat a bug.
Fair enough, but are all halflings portrayed this way in the book? Could there not be some halflings who are Roma-like?
 

Drowbane said:
Halflings in my games call themselves "Hin". Ta hell with whatever canon decides to call them. :p
Halfings in my game call themselves "hobbits".

(Dwarves call themselves "dvergar", elves call themselves "alfar". You get the idea.)
 

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