Can You Empower Claws of the Beast?
- Thread starter KarinsDad
- Start date
Infiniti2000
First Post
"Can You Empower Claws of the Beast?"
Of course. You can empower any spell, spell levels permitting (or having a rod, divine metamagic, etc.).
Of course. You can empower any spell, spell levels permitting (or having a rod, divine metamagic, etc.).
pawsplay
Hero
The effect of the spell is significantly different than a fireball.
You gain two natural attacks with your claws, each dealing 1d4 points of damage (1d6 if you are Large, or 1d3 if you are Small) plus your Strength bonus.
Your claws are natural weapons, so you are considered armed when attacking with them, and they can be affected by powers, spells, and effects that enhance or improve natural. You can choose to deal nonlethal damage with your claws, taking the standard –4 penalty on your attack roll.
Your claws work just like the natural weapons of many monsters.
The effect of the power is to give you claws, not to deal damage. Consider for a moment: who is the target of the power? How well it be maximized when it used on me?
You gain two natural attacks with your claws, each dealing 1d4 points of damage (1d6 if you are Large, or 1d3 if you are Small) plus your Strength bonus.
Your claws are natural weapons, so you are considered armed when attacking with them, and they can be affected by powers, spells, and effects that enhance or improve natural. You can choose to deal nonlethal damage with your claws, taking the standard –4 penalty on your attack roll.
Your claws work just like the natural weapons of many monsters.
The effect of the power is to give you claws, not to deal damage. Consider for a moment: who is the target of the power? How well it be maximized when it used on me?
Marshall
First Post
KarinsDad said:
Havent we been thru this? I seem to recall having the same argument with Fantastic Machine, Thunderlance, Summon X.
If you dont believe that Maximized Summon Monster X gives you critters with all 18 base stats, max hp, that do max damage on every attack, you already know the answer to this question.
Hypersmurf
Moderatarrrrh...
My rule of thumb - not necessarily because it's clearly defined anywhere, but because I need something to make the decision clear - is that if a random numeric effect is defined in the text of the spell, it's Empowerable. If it's defined elsewhere (and perhaps echoed in the text of the spell), it isn't.
Example: Scorching Ray. The effect of the spell is "One or more rays". But the damage dealt by those rays is a random numeric effect defined within the spell text. Empowerable.
Example: Shillelagh. "2d6" and "3d6" are mentioned in the text of the spell, but these are not definitions; they are merely repeating the information defined elsewhere for damage dealt by a Medium or Large club. Not Empowerable.
Example: Flame Blade. The 1d8 damage is defined in the spell. Empowerable.
Example: Summon Monster. The damage dealt by a monster is not mentioned in the spell text, but found in the Monster Manual. The damage is not Empowerable (though the number of creatures summoned is, potentially).
Example: Mordenkainen's Faithful Hound. The Hound's damage is defined in the spell text. Empowerable - and possibly an example of the weakness of a rule of thumb
So I would rule the Claws of the Beast - which defines the damage dealt - is Empowerable. If it said "dealing damage as normal for a Claw attack for a creature of your size category (1d3 for Small, 1d4 for Mediuim, 1d6 for Large)", I would consider this to be repeated information, not defined information.
So my rule of thumb draws a fairly fine line, but at least it means I can rule consistently. Otherwise, the same logic that says "The spell creates claws, the claws deal the damage" would apply to, say, Flaming Sphere...
-Hyp.
Example: Scorching Ray. The effect of the spell is "One or more rays". But the damage dealt by those rays is a random numeric effect defined within the spell text. Empowerable.
Example: Shillelagh. "2d6" and "3d6" are mentioned in the text of the spell, but these are not definitions; they are merely repeating the information defined elsewhere for damage dealt by a Medium or Large club. Not Empowerable.
Example: Flame Blade. The 1d8 damage is defined in the spell. Empowerable.
Example: Summon Monster. The damage dealt by a monster is not mentioned in the spell text, but found in the Monster Manual. The damage is not Empowerable (though the number of creatures summoned is, potentially).
Example: Mordenkainen's Faithful Hound. The Hound's damage is defined in the spell text. Empowerable - and possibly an example of the weakness of a rule of thumb
So I would rule the Claws of the Beast - which defines the damage dealt - is Empowerable. If it said "dealing damage as normal for a Claw attack for a creature of your size category (1d3 for Small, 1d4 for Mediuim, 1d6 for Large)", I would consider this to be repeated information, not defined information.
So my rule of thumb draws a fairly fine line, but at least it means I can rule consistently. Otherwise, the same logic that says "The spell creates claws, the claws deal the damage" would apply to, say, Flaming Sphere...
-Hyp.
tomBitonti
Hero
Spiritual weapon
If that worked for Claws of the beast, wouldn't it work for Spiritual Weapon?
KarinsDad said:
If that worked for Claws of the beast, wouldn't it work for Spiritual Weapon?
