Challenging Challenge Ratings...again

[Kerrick]

So I applied the revised ECL calcs to all my monsters, and a funny thing happened... 90% of them ended up having the same ECL as their HD (within +/-1, though it was dead-on in most cases). Dragons and most outsiders, interestingly, had about the same ratio of HD/ECL - around 1.3 to 1.4 for dragons (it increases as they age), and ~1.25 for outsiders. Magical beasts still need some tweaking, though - they're a bit off - and some of the dinosaurs probably need their HD reduced, but I can't be bothered.

Note that I'm using heavily modified monster creation rules, too - along with v5, I've come up with some modifications of my own, including stat scores, HD by type/size, and the natural armor mods. Overall, though, it's a pretty solid system. I was really surprised how it turned out.

 

[wizuriel]

thanks, seeing how to build stuff with the system now. Was looking over the party EL and wondering what do you do when party levels but their EL doesn't change?

EX would be a 5th lvl party with 4 members and 25pt buy. At lvl 5 their EL would be 13 and lvl 6 their EL remains at 13. Tend to get some patches where EL doesn't change for 3 levels (ex lvl 11-13 the party would be EL 17). Should just keep throwing similar challenges at them or make them closer to EL +-0? Or throw more challenges?

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey there wizuriel!

thanks, seeing how to build stuff with the system now. Was looking over the party EL and wondering what do you do when party levels but their EL doesn't change?

EX would be a 5th lvl party with 4 members and 25pt buy. At lvl 5 their EL would be 13 and lvl 6 their EL remains at 13. Tend to get some patches where EL doesn't change for 3 levels (ex lvl 11-13 the party would be EL 17). Should just keep throwing similar challenges at them or make them closer to EL +-0? Or throw more challenges?

If the party are being challenged (and having fun) then I would suggest keep doing the same thing.

 

[Scurvy_Platypus]

Errr... just out of curiosity...

Did v6 ever get done? I've no clue if it'd be substantially different from v5, but figured I'd ask. Post 10 of this very thread (2 and a half years ago) mentions a v6, so...

*shrug*

Like I said, just asking. I just dug through this thread and found I'd asked about this a year and a week ago, so thought I'd check and see if there was an update or if I missed something.

 

[Pssthpok]

heh.

Nope, not out yet... and it's all so classified that UK can't just post it so people can use it or argue it or whatever, which would make things a lot more interesting. It's like a game we play 'round here.

 

[Kerrick]

Double heh. I've given up asking/pestering about it, myself.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Howdy Scurvy!

Errr... just out of curiosity...

Did v6 ever get done? I've no clue if it'd be substantially different from v5, but figured I'd ask. Post 10 of this very thread (2 and a half years ago) mentions a v6, so...

*shrug*

Like I said, just asking. I just dug through this thread and found I'd asked about this a year and a week ago, so thought I'd check and see if there was an update or if I missed something.

I am sure I have explained numerous times what the changes to v6 are. The mechanical changes are very simple and take about two minutes to implement.

The mechanical differences in Version 6

1) Apply the Silver Rule to all factor totals, not just factor totals less than 20.

NB. Previously, Factor Totals above 20 were supposed to simply subtract 3 rather than apply the x0.833 Silver Rule modifier.

2) Challenge Rating is no longer CR x2 = EL +4, its now CR x2 = EL +8.

NB. The minor added confusion on this is that its balanced to 3.5E Spellcaster Classes (which are more powerful), rather than the Martial Classes*. If you wanted to use a party of solely 3.5E Martial Classes then either change to my revised classes (using those as a guide to do the ones I haven't fixed) or use CR x2 = EL +6.

*See my website for Revised Martial Classes which bring them up to balance.

Immortality

The hold-up on any new v6 document (aside from my general apathy on the matter) is basically one of nomenclature. In effect changing all the terms so that the whole thing isn't confusing, so that 'Challenge Rating' isn't mentioned in place of the arbitrary numerical 'Factor' that eventually gets turned into Effective Class Level and subsequently Challenge Rating.

 

[Gansk]

Does the change to EL affect the tables that measure the difficulty of an encounter based on the difference in EL?

Is EL-4 still a moderate encounter, or has it changed to EL-8?

 

[Upper_Krust]

Howdy Gansk!

Does the change to EL affect the tables that measure the difficulty of an encounter based on the difference in EL?

Is EL-4 still a moderate encounter, or has it changed to EL-8?

Good question. Yes it does change the tables. Basically you want to halve the previous differences. Both positive and negative.

So the previously EL -4 = moderate encounter should now be EL -2 = moderate encounter.