Cleric/Druid Question

Angerland

First Post
I have seen many folks talking of CoDzilla's on the boards (here and Wotc). Since I am by no means a regular power gamer, I was wondering what does it take to power up a Cleric or a druid to truly powerful status?

If there are already links out please show me so I don't bog down with a thread that may have been asked and answered 1,000,000 times before.

I would like to see both as I want to play one of these classes in an upcoming campaign. By nature I love a good solid melee type but I have played wizards and rogues in the past as well.
 

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What does it take to power-up a cleric?

Err.....waking up in the morning? :)

I found the most mileage out of the feats Divine Metamagic (quicken) and Divine Spell Power. Pretty much any Clr combo is made *much* better with these two.

I must admit, I stayed away from Persistent spells because...<hangs head in embarrassment>...that was too cheesy even for me.
 

well druids are not quite the de'zilla they once were because of the errata, but for a driud, his power is picking the right animal companion and wildshape fourm. A druid only needs good wis and con (with errata) and only good wisdom without the errata. also feats need to be picked wisely and you must pick natural spell at level 6.

if your going druid i might pick

1 ashbound summoning

3 feat of choice

6 natural spell

9 feat of choice

12 dragon wildshape (my fav)

if your dm lets any feat into the game, grab greenbound summoning and watch the campaign fall apart. (warning, do not try this at home)

this website should help you

http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=465005

you should pick cleric or druid based on your feelings or flavor.
 
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Nail said:
What does it take to power-up a cleric?

Err.....waking up in the morning? :)
... and an hour of preperation.

Also, being a Cheney enough to tell your partymembers to 'Go heal yourself'. They might be bleading out in the third round, but you just finished buffing, don't give up a full round attack to heal them.

Seriously though, a second cleric dedicated for heals on wheels is necessary. For all the 'Clerics are so unfair' talk, people arn't crawling over themselves to play one. The same for druids in my experience. Sorcerers and Barbarians though, never a lack of those.
 

The power of these classes is conditional.

First, you have to realize that "cleric" is a hundred different varieties on a theme. Each cleric has a pool of spells that any cleric can cast, and then 2 other separate pools of often unique spells and the slots to cast them in the form of their domains. Each domain also comes with either a special ability or a skill bonus/availability.

Just at their simplest, a cleric is powerful because given 24 hours notice, he can come up with almost any magical effect. It might not be the perfect spell for the situation, but he will be able to come up with something that at least will help a little. If the situation falls within his domain, then he can handle it easily.

Depending on alignment, the "basic" spell pool also has the flexibility of spontaneous conversion of prepared spells in to either healing or inflicting spells, which can be used against undead.

The cleric also has a third pool of supernatural ability: turning/rebuking. At the basic level, this provides a method for handling undead. By taking optional feats you have a choice of greater access to domain spells, metamagic feat options, greater access to summon creature spells, or even better methods of handling undead.

Added to this is armor proficiency that does not interfere with spell casting, and proficiently with martial weapons. Even when out of spells and turning attempts, the cleric can still defend himself.

Now the conditional part:

A cleric "tricked out" for fighting undead is not going to be as useful in an "Against the Giants" game. He will still be useful, just not as useful.

If you put that same cleric into "Crypt of the vampire lord", then the rest of the party is along for the ride. I ran a level 10 female hafling cleric of Praylor with improved turning, sun and good domains, extra turning, disciple of the sun, Wis 18, Cha 20, and +2 staff of disruption. She kept shape stone, flamestrike, and detect magic preped. She, with the help of the party druid, detected, and negated every trap in the dungeon by using detect magic to find them, and then stoneshaping around or over them. If they found anything suspicious, they just covered it in stone. If they found a locked door, she stoneshaped the doorframe. The trick of the dungeon was that it was supposed to be one way with a trapped protacullus that locked them into the dungeon. Once this was defeated, the party was able to take the "meat grinder" dungeon in sections. On fights, she greater turning-ed all the undead into dust in round one, and flamestriked everything else. I made the character at the request of the gm to bring into a game so he could run an undead based module for the group, who didn't have a cleric at the time. We played half the dungeon, and then dropped the game never to return. The other players weren't having much fun, as the 2'9 39 lbs, female hafling was killing everything from 30+ ft away, leaving the fighters with little to do, while at the same doing the rogue's job. We figured that she would destory the vampire in surprize round, so there was no challenge,.... no fun...., in the module.

And I wasn't even trying hard to power game. If I had made her human, with the extra feat, she would have been worse! (better)
 

What does it take to power up a druid? Nothing. I had two druids in a long running campaign, the halfling one took a level of monk later and the other one was an elven archer (singleclass druid).

The archer didn't try to get into the spotlight at all. She just happened to have a nice spell handy that saved the party. Once or twice per evening. In the meantime, she pestered my BBEGs with arrows from her magic bow. She shot nicely.

The halfling dude was a bit powergaming (as much as I allow it). At the beginning he took a power drop since he was a replacement char and later because of the monk level... then level 8 druid came and he started to play giant octopus with Animal Growth (thanks for the errata now). The final fight of the campaign consisting of a row of duels starred him in Dire Hawk form against the black dragon mount of the converted ex-PC paladin now vampire blackguard. He would have won.

So what does a druid need to rock the game? He needs to survive long enough to act.

Did I mention that the other two chars who dominated that campaign were clerics? Read my sig and you'll see.
 

Darklone said:
... then level 8 druid came and he started to play giant octopus with Animal Growth (thanks for the errata now).
When I read the eratta & the revisited RotG article, I thought it said you keep your type (humanoid) and DON'T gain the animal type. I'll admit I'm not well versed in it, so I could be wrong.
 


TheGogmagog said:
When I read the eratta & the revisited RotG article, I thought it said you keep your type (humanoid) and DON'T gain the animal type. I'll admit I'm not well versed in it, so I could be wrong.
Yupp. But said druid went powermonger before that errata came out ;)
 

Optimizing (basic): know your class abilities and know your spells. Druids and Clerics don't have sexy spell lists like the Wizard; you won't have access to the classic flashy spells. But you do have access to some really phenomenally good spells, and I don't just mean flame strike. Like a Wizard, you benefit greatly from intelligence about your next day's encounters, so get busy with the Divinations (including augury and commune on occasion; certainly including scry when it becomes available).

For a Druid, know your animals. You get one to keep (your Companion), you get to turn into them (Wild Shape), and you get to summon them. Know which ones are best in combat, which ones are fastest, and which ones have special utility value. Your DM may nerf you by restricting the animals with which you are familiar: that's fine, there are good animals in each terrain. Know which terrains you visit during the campaign, and if you really need to get up & close with a polar bear, make it a quest.

For a Cleric, know your summons. You have a bunch of utility spells that many people forget entirely. Also, as a reminder, know your buffs. Assume you will have at most two rounds to buff before combat, and frequently zero rounds before combat. Plan what you will do in these two different situations. Quicken Spell is very useful for you, because your 1st level spells are still really good -- quick bless benefits your whole party, and quick divine favor gives you a very nice bonus to attack and damage, and you can wait to cast it for when you're about to lay down a Full Attack.

Both of these classes benefit greatly from Scribe Scroll. Both can make excellent use of Craft Wondrous Item.

Cheers, -- N
 

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