Closing Spell: As powerful as it looks?

[Sitara]

Just curious, is the Battlemage PP's closing spel daily truly as powerful as it looks, if you use it after burning your dailies? Or am I missing something here? I know bloodmagus is generally regarded as more powerful (especially using that broken combo over on charop) but closing spell in of itself does make battlemage quite appealing asa paragon path.

Thoughts on this?

 

[kerbarian]

Actually, I think the Blood Mage level-20 daily is far stronger. The main advantage Closing Spell has is being a burst 5 rather than a burst 3. But if you look at the effects...

Closing Spell is 8d10 + Int (if used as your last daily), which averages 44 + Int.

Destructive Salutation is 6d6 + Int + 10 ongoing, which is 21 + Int + (on average) 18 from the ongoing damage. So comparable damage, though Destructive Salutation doesn't do it all right away. On top of that, though, Destructive Salutation is a guaranteed stun against everyone in the burst, even if you miss. That's huge.

Also, the fact that Closing Spell has to be used as your last daily to be worthwhile seems like a significant limitation.

 

[Rith the Wanderer]

I agree, I think people are severely underestimating battlemage as a paragon path. Especially considering at epic tier you can get that closing spell as the last daily a couple times using stuff like shape magic and Arcane Mastery. Also, the blood mage's non-power abilities suck, besides the action point one, which I think is on par with the battlemages considering the battle mage can apply its bonus to both actions.

However, its destructive salutation is pretty amazing, its much better than closing spell, unless closing spell is the last daily left. Also blood pulse is slightly better than forceful retort, depending on whether or not the DM is dumb and makes the enemies sprint at you anyway. I think their utilities are about on par.

Overall I think the wizard PP are actually really well balanced, besides the Spiral tower one, which I think is clearly worse than the other 3. I really think it depends on what you want to do with your character.

 

[Sitara]

Something that strikes me as a little silly though is that even a fighter who takes a wizard multi-class feat and then the battlemage PP can end up using closing spell to its full effect, just like a pure wizard himself. it wouldn'tbeaproblem if clsingspell wasn't so powerful, but....I don't know its kind of annoying.

Anyhow, another benefit to closing spell that I can think off that it really encourages you to conserve all your dailies for that BBEG boss battle; then you discharge all your dailies and finsih it off with a closing spell!!

 

[Rith the Wanderer]

Actually, I think the Blood Mage level-20 daily is far stronger. The main advantage Closing Spell has is being a burst 5 rather than a burst 3. But if you look at the effects...

Closing Spell is 8d10 + Int (if used as your last daily), which averages 44 + Int.

Destructive Salutation is 6d6 + Int + 10 ongoing, which is 21 + Int + (on average) 18 from the ongoing damage. So comparable damage, though Destructive Salutation doesn't do it all right away. On top of that, though, Destructive Salutation is a guaranteed stun against everyone in the burst, even if you miss. That's huge.

Also, the fact that Closing Spell has to be used as your last daily to be worthwhile seems like a significant limitation.

I think the 18 ongoing damage on average is misleading, but isn't it closer to 17 than 18? Either way, though the stun is indeed awesome, realize that closing spell affects over twice as many squares, and you can choose the damage type (important for vulnerabilities and those who take the bonus damage feats). I think that as the last day spell it is slightly better than Destructive salutation, if only for the fact that it deals the highest one turn damage of any area attack in the entire PHB, at level 20. Whether this makes it better overall, well, probably not.

 

[Victim]

Closing Spell is good, but I agree that it's generally not as good as the Blood Mage 20. The increased area size along with the ability to change energy type are handy though, especially if you have other feats that relate to that keyword. For example, Resounding Thunder could make it a Burst 6. An Archmage who burns her dailies early and then runs around firing off Closing Spell every encounter would be funny.

But the virtually automatic stun on DS is huge.

And, in my opinion, the only other really good Battle Mage ability is the AP one. Arcane Riposte and Battle Edge pale in comparison to the blood mage abilities, and Blood Pulse is another awesome spell.

 

[Minigiant]

Closing spell is something you have to build up to. The variation of damage type is great with some feats but DS's stun is too good.

The great thing about Closing spell is your wizard can make a long rant and end it with "In closing, die (insert insult)!"