Comments and questions on 3.5 from a Newbie

[Edena_of_Neith]

(is reading your posts)

Great fight, Michael!
This thread is a lot of fun, and it's great reading your writing, folks.

I did not realize running denied you your Dex. I read it, undoubtedly, but missed it anyways.

Lidda: I spared you before. I won't do so now.
Lidda: (draws her short sword, makes one attack) 19. Hits. Threatens. 11. +11. Critical. Damage. 3. 3. +3. +3. 12 points.

Narrin (30 points remaining) Enough of this. I'm getting out of here!
Narrin: (decides to run. Fatal mistake.)

Lidda, AOO for Narrin leaving threatened square by running, AOO is a sneak attack because Narrin is denied AC bonus: 17. Hits. Damage: 1. +3. +6d6 (4, 4, 4, 3, 5, 3) 27 points of damage. Narrin has 39 on him, and has only 3 hit points left.

Lidda: Going somewhere, brigand?

Lidda: Takes out her long bow as a move action. Nocks an arrow as a free action (she can fire twice per round, and since Narrin is running, would get two sneak attacks on him.)

Lidda: You had better halt, brigand. (sends an arrow into a tree in front of him.)

Narrin: (stops) If you kill me, you'll never find out where the healer is!
Lidda: (fires a regular shot, seeing her foe is ready to collapse)
15. Hits. 4. +2. 6 points. Narrin is down, but not dead.
Lidda: I never said I was going to kill you.
Lidda goes up and binds Narrin. Then she employs the heal skill on him.

For the record:

Lidda has a charisma of 8. Perhaps the artists drew her with that in mind.
But I think she's pretty. She's cute, too.

 

[IcyCool]

Narrin (30 points remaining) Enough of this. I'm getting out of here!
Narrin: (decides to run. Fatal mistake.)

Narrin, being a reasonably seasoned adventurer, should probably take the withdraw action here, to avoid the AOO.

Lidda: Takes out her long bow as a move action. Nocks an arrow as a free action (she can fire twice per round, and since Narrin is running, would get two sneak attacks on him.)

Since Narrin ran, it is likely that he is farther than 30 ft. away from Lidda. If you read the sneak attack description, you'll see that you can only use it on ranged attacks within 30ft. (Barring any spells, like Sniper Shot).

 

[sniffles]

Patryn, is there a Feat that negates this possibility of hitting your friend, if you fire into a grapple?

None that I'm aware of.

EDIT: You can also only feint in melee combat.

Would Precise Shot not negate some or all of the penalty of firing into a grapple? I've been perusing the SRD and can't find anything specific to a ranged attack made vs. a grappled opponent.

(Note: Wow, looking at monboesen's 12th level fighter, maybe my 10th level fighter is in a low-magic, low-treasure game after all!)

 

[Edena_of_Neith]

Narrin's Revenge!

Narrin is tired of being defeated in all these example combats. (lol)
It's Narrin's turn to win.

(gives Narrin a +2 greatsword instead of +1 greatsword, Improved Sunder Feat)

Narrin: It's just you and me now, assassin!
Lidda (softly) That's very true.

Lidda draws longsword, attacks, hits (drew sword, so only one attack.) 12 points of damage.
Narrin (scornfully) Is that the best you can do?

Narrin: Sunders. Opposed rolls: Narrin 11, Lidda 12. Narrin is +5 BAB, +4 Str, +4 greatsword (two-handed weapon), +2 for a +2 greatsword, and +4 size. His modified roll is a 30. Lidda is +9 BAB, +1 str, +2 for a +2 magical weapon, for a 23.
Narrin hit's Lidda's +2 short sword.
Damage: 2d6+9. 6. 6. +9. 21 points of damage.
Lidda's +2 short sword is shattered. (Could someone point out the page in the DMG for hardness and hps of magical items? I can't find it ... although I'm pretty sure Narrin's attack just did the job.) (If it's not enough damage, he takes his second attack with the greatsword to inflict a second sunder!)

Narrin: Puny weapons and flighty maneuvers do not make a warrior, little girl.

Lidda: Withdraws on her move, draws her short bow +1.

Narrin: Charges, attacks. 13 +11. Misses.

Lidda: Fires twice. 5. 15. Hits both times. 7 and 5 points of damage.

Narrin: Sunders the +1 short bow. Narrin 23, Lidda 22. Narrin hits. Damage 17 points. Scratch one +1 crossbow.

Narrin: (laughs) Puny weapons, now flinders.

Lidda: (runs)

Narrin: AOO: 14. +11 is 25. Hits (the Rogue's Uncanny Dodge and Improved Uncanny Dodge do not allow her to retain her Dex bonus when running!) Damage: 13 points.

Lidda: runs 80 feet. (Narrin goes on laughing.)

Narrin: You can run, but you can't hide!
Narrin: Double move, 60 feet. Doesn't care to be sneak attacked because he was running and not keeping his guard up. Draws his bow as he goes.

Lidda: runs another 80 feet.

Narrin: How far can you run, little girl? There's nowhere to go.
Narrin: fires twice. No Dex bonus for Lidda because she's running (not even for Uncanny Dodge and Improved Uncanny Dodge!)
Narrin: 18, 15. +6, +6. Hits both times. Damage: 4 (+3) and 5 (+3) is 15 points. Lidda drops to 29 hit points.

Narrin: (grins) What fine target practice. Run, little girl! Run, while you can!

 

[MichaelH]

Narrin: Sunders. Opposed rolls: Narrin 11, Lidda 12. Narrin is +5 BAB, +4 Str, +4 greatsword (two-handed weapon), +2 for a +2 greatsword, and +4 size. His modified roll is a 30. Lidda is +9 BAB, +1 str, +2 for a +2 magical weapon, for a 23.
Narrin hit's Lidda's +2 short sword.
Damage: 2d6+9. 6. 6. +9. 21 points of damage.
Lidda's +2 short sword is shattered. (Could someone point out the page in the DMG for hardness and hps of magical items? I can't find it ... although I'm pretty sure Narrin's attack just did the job.) (If it's not enough damage, he takes his second attack with the greatsword to inflict a second sunder!)

Its on page 222 in the DMG. Check the DMG errata, however. This paragraph has been errata'd to say that for each "+" of enhancement the weapon gains 2 to its hardness and 10 to its hit points. You find the ordinary hardness and hit points on page 158 in the PHB. Note that Lidda's weapons are small so the numbers in the chart are divided by 2. Therefore, Lidda's +2 shortsword has a hardness of 9 and 21 hit points (5+4 and 1+20). Narrin's damage of 21 points is reduced to 12 by the hardness of the +2 short sword, which now has 9 hit points. Narrin will need one more blow to sunder Lidda's weapon.

Narrin: Sunders the +1 short bow. Narrin 23, Lidda 22. Narrin hits. Damage 17 points. Scratch one +1 crossbow.

Lidda has a +1 composite shortbow. Its hardness is 4 (2+2) and it has 12 hit points (2+10). Narrin's 17 damage is reduced to 13 by the hardness. The shortbow is sundered!

 

[monboesen]

(Note: Wow, looking at monboesen's 12th level fighter, maybe my 10th level fighter is in a low-magic, low-treasure game after all!)

And Bolgor is build with standard wealth limits. That's 88.000 gp at 12 level. As our groups games don't really follow those he looks mighty impressive to me to

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

Would Precise Shot not negate some or all of the penalty of firing into a grapple?

It might negate a penalty on your attack roll you might be experiencing (say, if one of your allies was in melee with the grapplers), but it would not affect the random target selection.

 

[Jim Hague]

It might negate a penalty on your attack roll you might be experiencing (say, if one of your allies was in melee with the grapplers), but it would not affect the random target selection.

I can't seem to find these random target rules...can you provide a page reference?

 

[BobROE]

But remember - when you make a ranged attack at someone that's grappling, there's a chance you'll hit someone other than your target. You're supposed to determine who's actually hit randomly.

Where is this rule? I know I've read it somewhere (so does one of my players), but whenever it comes up we can't find it.

 

[MichaelH]

I ran the battle again with the following changes. In round 1 Hennett Dimension Door's to the square north of Lidda again. He is carrying his shortspear. Narrin now has a +2 greatsword (+12 attack, 2d6+10 damage). I also changed his feats to Cleave, Improved Sunder, Iron Will, Power Attack, Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization with Greatsword. It started in a similar fashion but took a differant turn quickly.

Round 2

-Lidda decides she should focus on dodging this brigand's greatsword for the time being. She shifts 5 feet northwest and fires off a couple arrows at Narrin since he is still trying to recover from his run up the hill. 18+18+1=37 hit, and 3+13+1=17 miss. The arrow does 25 damage and Narrin has 17 left. "Assassins have no honor."

-The dire bears charges Claire and gives her a taste of his large claw. 19+19+2=40 hit. This reduces Claire's hit points by 17. She has 7 left. The dire bear also tries to grab Claire with that paw. 17+23=40 grapple check. Claire's grapple is 1+2=3. No chance. Claire is dragged into the dire bear's space. Both are considered grappling.

-Claire screams for help and delays.

-Grom hustles 60 feet toward the battle, pulling his magical battle axe and throwing axe while he moves. He wants to help Narrin.

-Hennett defensively casts Hold Monster on the dire bear (8+24=32, DC20). But the dire bear shrugs off the magic with a defiant roar (13+9=22, DC20). Hennett adjusts 5 feet north.

-Narrin closes 5 feet northwest on Lidda and decides the shortbow must go. He uses his improved sundering skills and takes a powerful shot (full power attack, -5 to hit, +10 damage). Narrin's opposed attack roll is 11+12+4+4-5=26. Lidda's roll is 5+13-4=14. The bow is hit and takes 31 damage less its hardness of 4, or 27 damage. It only has 12 hit points and is destroyed. "My bow. You will pay for that!"

-Claire struggles against the dire bear and tries to use her small stature to wiggle free. She uses her escape artistry skills but cannot wriggle free from the dire bear's awesome grip (6+3=9 for Claire, 8+23=31 for the dire bear).


Round 3

-Lidda sees an opening. She adjusts 5 feet to the southeast and flanks Narrin. She draws her magical blade and attacks a vital spot (10+13+2=25). She runs Narrin through for 29 damage. Narrin only had 17 left, so he dies instantly.

-The dire bear tries to swat Claire with the claw he used to pull her in but cannot do any serious damage to her (natural 1). However, his other claw plunges into Claire's throat (natural 20, 8+19-4=23, crit) dealing a massive 28 damage. Claire's current hit point total was 7, so she girgles to death on her own blood. Poor Claire. The dire bear turns on Lidda with its powerful bite (18+13=31 hit). Lidda takes 16 damage and has 41 left.

-Grom charges Hennett (15+9+2=26 hit). He cuts Hennett for 10 damage, leaving the sorcerer with 49 hit points.

-Hennett notices that he can get Grom and the dire bear with his potent lightning bolt. He moves 5 feet northwest and casts a maximized lighning bolt due south catching them both. They take 60 damage or 30 with a successful DC19 reflex save. Grom rolls 17=6=23 and dodges the full effect, but still takes 30 damage. He only has 6 hit points left. The dire bear cannot get out of the way (5+9=14) and takes all 60 points of damage, reducing it to 45. The powerful electric charge also wreaked havoc on the dire bear's insides, or should have. But the dire bear's fortitude is too great for it to die just yet (natural 20 on the massive damage save).


Round 4

-Lidda knows she will not last long next to the dire bear. She skurries 5 feet to the northeast and pulls out her potion of invisibility. Down it goes and Lidda disappears. Lidda is now dodging the dire bear.

-The dire bear moves 5 feet north and attacks Grom. With one powerful claw swat (3+19=22) Grom takes 17 damage. Since he only had 6 left, Grom is raked across the face and chest and drops dead at the dire bear's feet. The dire bear swipes his other claw where Lidda had been standing only a moment ago, but does not connect (6+19=25). But it also tries to bite and connects with the dodging rogue (17+13=30, Lidda's AC is 30 with Dodge.) Since Lidda is invisible, there is a 50% miss chance here. On a roll of 01-50 on d100, the attack still misses. The roll is 59. Lidda takes 17 damage and is reduced to 24 hit points.

-Hennett fires off another maximized lightning bolt. The dire bear cannot dodge out of the way (9+9=18, DC19) and takes 60 damage. This reduces its hit points to -15 and kills it outright. If it survived it would have to make another DC15 Fort save or die from massive damage.