D&D 5E Companion thread to "5E Survivor - Subclasses (Part VI: Fighters)"

[Undrave]

Turns out there's a lot of things to say about the Fighter subclasses over on the Survivor thread, and I think it would be less annoying to move the conversations about them to its own thread instead of polluting the Survivor thread further.

So I'll start :

The UA Scout Fighter is the most terrible thing I've ever seen! I thought the Banneret was bad but that Scout is just TERRIBLE! It gets basically nothing past level 3 and it doesn't really have any modicum of flavour.

The Sharpshooter was interesting but its later level features feel too weak.

I'm sad the Brute didn't get a second go, it seems to be what the Champion was supposed to be, but, you know, actually good. Except maybe for the devastating critical thing? It also needed some out of combat help, like maybe applying your Brute die to STR/DEX ability checks?

 

[CleverNickName]

I really, really wish I could have added the Gunslinger to the list, and not just because of Critical Role. It fills a niche in the game, it's a good bridge between Fighter and Artificer, and it reminds us all that guns existed alongside swords and halberds, even if they weren't mentioned in the Lord of the Rings books.

But Wizards of the Coast didn't release Tal'Dorei, and they didn't add it to Wildemount when they had the chance, so it's not legal for the Survivor thread. Bummer.

 

[Corinnguard]

Turns out there's a lot of things to say about the Fighter subclasses over on the Survivor thread, and I think it would be less annoying to move the conversations about them to its own thread instead of polluting the Survivor thread further.

So I'll start :

The UA Scout Fighter is the most terrible thing I've ever seen! I thought the Banneret was bad but that Scout is just TERRIBLE! It gets basically nothing past level 3 and it doesn't really have any modicum of flavour.

The Sharpshooter was interesting but its later level features feel too weak.

I'm sad the Brute didn't get a second go, it seems to be what the Champion was supposed to be, but, you know, actually good. Except maybe for the devastating critical thing? It also needed some out of combat help, like maybe applying your Brute die to STR/DEX ability checks?

When I first started playing 5e over a year, I decided to pick the UA Scout Fighter subclass for no other better reason than my character being a Dragonborn Lance Scout from Tymanther. Luckily I came across a variant of the Scout subclass on D&D Wiki. Scout, Variant (5e Subclass) - D&D Wiki

And luckier still, my DM allowed me to dump the UA Scout for this one. It's roughly based off of the Scout class from 3e's Complete Adventurer.

 

[RealAlHazred]

Okay, so here's where I can rave about the Variant Fighter by Vorpal Dice Press?

So, the idea is, this homebrew takes the Maneuvers from the Battle Master, and distributes them among all fighter subclasses. Each subclass also has special Maneuvers only available to them, as well as a general pool of Fighter Maneuvers to choose from.

This version is actually an OGL version, using only the material in the Basic D&D rules as a basis. This means some subclasses are not adapted because they were in the PHB only. There was a previous version of the Variant Fighter shared by /u/layhnet on Reddit, that had those subclasses, but that version's been removed; you might be able to find it if you Google appropriately.

Anyway, the subclasses include: Champion, Tactician (the Battle Master replacement), Arcane Marksman (a vast improvement on the Arcane Archer, IMO), Bounty Hunter, Colossal Bully, Duelist, Survivalist (kind of a spell-less Ranger), and Templar (kind of a semi-spell-less Paladin). I had a couple of Variant Fighter players in a Ghosts of Saltmarsh game, and they were a big hit. They didn't feel overpowered compared to the other characters, but they still had their own tricks they could pull off, that involved tactical play during fights (which is where Fighters should shine, anyway).

So, I highly recommend people check it out if they're not satisfied with the 5E Fighter class and subclasses.

 

[Corinnguard]

Okay, so here's where I can rave about the Variant Fighter by Vorpal Dice Press?

So, the idea is, this homebrew takes the Maneuvers from the Battle Master, and distributes them among all fighter subclasses. Each subclass also has special Maneuvers only available to them, as well as a general pool of Fighter Maneuvers to choose from.

This version is actually an OGL version, using only the material in the Basic D&D rules as a basis. This means some subclasses are not adapted because they were in the PHB only. There was a previous version of the Variant Fighter shared by /u/layhnet on Reddit, that had those subclasses, but that version's been removed; you might be able to find it if you Google appropriately.

Anyway, the subclasses include: Champion, Tactician (the Battle Master replacement), Arcane Marksman (a vast improvement on the Arcane Archer, IMO), Bounty Hunter, Colossal Bully, Duelist, Survivalist (kind of a spell-less Ranger), and Templar (kind of a semi-spell-less Paladin). I had a couple of Variant Fighter players in a Ghosts of Saltmarsh game, and they were a big hit. They didn't feel overpowered compared to the other characters, but they still had their own tricks they could pull off, that involved tactical play during fights (which is where Fighters should shine, anyway).

So, I highly recommend people check it out if they're not satisfied with the 5E Fighter class and subclasses.

The only part of the 5e Fighter class that I wasn't satisfied with was how the presence of so many Extra Attacks would slowly nerf the Two-Weapon Fighting Style in terms of how many attacks you can with your primary hand vs. your offhand. As a Dragonborn Fighter, I would use Action Surge for his breath weapon and then use my Action and Bonus Action for his TWF.

The Advanced 5th Edition Fighter is much better than the 5e Fighter because of it's combat maneuvers (from three of the eleven combat traditions in the RPG) and it's social pillar elements.

 

[Undrave]

I really, really wish I could have added the Gunslinger to the list, and not just because of Critical Role. It fills a niche in the game, it's a good bridge between Fighter and Artificer, and it reminds us all that guns existed alongside swords and halberds, even if they weren't mentioned in the Lord of the Rings books.

But Wizards of the Coast didn't release Tal'Dorei, and they didn't add it to Wildemount when they had the chance, so it's not legal for the Survivor thread. Bummer.

Gunslinger would have fit well in Eberron I think. Introduce magi-tech guns in there, make a Fighter subclass that’s basically MC’d into Artificer with a bit of Arcane Archer in there.

 

[Ancalagon]

There is another great use for the brute class: NPC fighter. The bonus to saves makes it a lot harder for the PCs to shut down with a quick spell. You can also just "give" its powers to a foe (say an ogre?) that you want to boost.

 

[Ancalagon]

As far as the Arcane archer only having 2 shots per short rests (vs 4 for a battle master), I think that you have to also analyze the power of these shots - it certainly doesn't feel very "substantial" but then again, I think some of the shots are more powerful than the battlemaster...

but still, it does make it not so satisfying. Compare it to the RK for example...

 

[CleverNickName]

Y'all have convinced me. The Brute is now my favorite in this race.

 

[DeviousQuail]

As far as the Arcane archer only having 2 shots per short rests (vs 4 for a battle master), I think that you have to also analyze the power of these shots - it certainly doesn't feel very "substantial" but then again, I think some of the shots are more powerful than the battlemaster...

but still, it does make it not so satisfying. Compare it to the RK for example...

Arcane Archer has a terrible progression, too. An additional use of Arcane Shot if you start a fight without any shots remaining at level 15 and a couple more dice of damage at level 18. The Battle Master, Cavalier, Echo Knight, Eldritch Knight, Psi Warrior, Rune Knight, and Samurai all have way better progressions for their limited use abilities. Either through ASIs, prof bonus, or class levels.