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Comtemplating the Mearls articles - thinking out loud or 5E Design Ruminations?

delericho

Legend
I honestly don't know if 5e is coming soon. If I were in charge at WotC I would be desperately trying to find some way to keep 4e going for another 2 years before announcing 5e, but looking at the reduced output and the L&L columns...

However, if WotC are about to go ahead with 5e, they would do well to try to build a bit more longevity into the line this time. If only for the job security of the design team - corporations tend not to let people coast on past sales; they tend to ask "what have you done for me lately?"

So...

I think part of the problem with 4e was that the line saturated fairly quickly. Obviously, everyone will buy the core (that is the rules required to play the game; not the "everything is core" line WotC tried to sell), and a significant chunk will probably buy one splatbook to support what they're doing. But sales for "Martial Power 2" are going to be much lower than for "Martial Power", and is there really going to be much market for, say, "Psionic Power", supporting as it does PHB3?

I also think the heavy focus on rules supplements (that are, or try to be "evergreen products") is unwise. Once people have got to a certain depth of options, they just don't need any more. To keep the designers constantly developing new products, they really need some sort of "seasonal products".

So...

Rather than taking the 4e approach of a (relatively) small number of classes in the PHB, each with multiple builds and options all the way up to level 30, I would suggest picking the 15 or so classes with the most traction and putting them in, but with only a single build, a small number of options in the Heroic tier (or equivalent), and then only a single 'option' at each level beyond that.

(The 4e selection of races is actually pretty decent. I would suggest dropping the half-elf and the eladrin, and replacing them with the warforged and the shardmind, since those seem to be the ones that have caught on, but otherwise I think it's fine.)

By doing this, you hopefully extend out the market for splatbooks - with only limited options, people will want the splatbook for the class they're playing, and by going for the 15 strongest archetypes, you've hopefully got people playing all the classes. (Whether the 'splatbooks' are actually books, or power cards, or DDI exclusive, or all of the above is, of course, another debate.)

Bear in mind: anything that isn't included in that core can always be added later - but it will never warrant the same level of popularity or support, barring the occasional "breakout star". And, of course, lack of support leads to lack of popularity, and lack of popularity leads to lack of support... Basically, how much support have the Gnome or Bard had since they got dropped from PHB1? Some, but not much seems the answer, despite the cries at their omission.

With settings, I think there's probably a market for slightly more than the 3 books in the 4e model, but probably not much more. (And certainly, I'd drop the adventure in favour of a bestiary.) There's also probably not much benefit in doing many settings - most people probably only need one, so you're competing with yourself. I think 4e's three settings (FR, Eberron, Dark Sun) may be about the right number, though perhaps came out too soon after one another. (Also, might be wise to let FR rest for a time.)

But finally, there are the "seasonal products" I mentioned. And, as far as I can see, this means adventures. With rules and options, there comes a point where people have enough, but there's always an, admittedly limited, market for adventures.

So, I would recommend WotC take a leaf out of Paizo's book with the Adventure Path product. Provide a monthly high-quality adventure, designed to form part of a six month arc. But produce only a single, fairly limited, print run. Once it's gone, it's gone.

One big advantage WotC would have is that they could then offer a DDI+ subscription that included the electronic form of the adventure, and indeed have it already set up for VTT use. (That might price at $10 per month at the cheapest subscription term.) In keeping with the "seasonal" nature of this, though, the adventures should probably only be supported for a limited time - otherwise you again get to the point where you can safely say, "I have enough". (The same should be true of Dungeon adventures as well, incidentally.)

Of course, the big problem here is that WotC don't have a reputation for doing adventures. Or rather, they do, but it's not the one they would want! So, that very first set of adventures would be absolutely crucial - they must be of exceptional quality for the line to work, even if that means taking a loss on their production.
 

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UngainlyTitan

Legend
Supporter
The more the community discusses about this and the more I try to word my thoughts about this edition thing, the more I believe this "E-think" to be outdated.

What about D&D going editionless in 2012?

The game won't develop in editions anymore, but in continuous digital updates. Players buy in via an intro book plus rules compendium and maintain their D&D via DDI plus hardware like tiles and tokens, maybe miniatures.

The explanation part of the books remain valid, the definition parts get supplanted by the database.

Each group defines its own "snapshot" of rules they use.

The only disadvantage is the end of edition wars - how shall the zealots spend their time with? :uhoh:
I think there will be one more edition but it is about 5 years away.

I believe that while 4e cannot be made to all the things that Mike Mearls is musing about in his column it can be made to do a facsimile of them.
So I kind of expect a basic D&D in hte next couple of years based on the 4e engine and using 4e monsters.
I also believe that Wizards need to learn the way of digital publication before going with a new edition.

I believe there was a disaster for WoTC in the launch of 4e and that disaster was Gleemax. I also believe that the glut of splat books early in the lifecycle was to buy time for the recouvery operation.

I still think that the digital tools are at least 2 years of their initial iteration and that WoTC needs to run with them for a year or two to learn how to market them properly before attepmting another major edition.

5e though may the last edition so called. By that time they will understand their digital operartions and if they build a scalable D&D engine then they can in effect support multiedition D&D.
 

CuRoi

First Post
Well, as someone that owns a bit of Hasbro stock (not much mind you, but it's part of the portfolio) I can look at the decreased printing schedule and say economics could have just as much to do with it as any sort of "winding down" of 4e.

I don't play 4e, but I think all the talk of a 5e is probably a bit premature. As far as Mike Mearls ruminations on attributes and other design elements, it's not like he's the only one contemplating it (On my website and in several posts here I've been pushing the idea of attributes replacing saves, AC, spell DCs, etc. for months...it seems to me a natural direction for the 4e rules.) I'm sure other people out there have home brew systems that do the same and Mearls is maybe just reflecting on the status of the community as opposed to any grand scheme.

Bottom line, Hasbro bought Wizards because they had Magic, not because they have DnD. I imagine pitching some edition change, new ruleset and all the marketing costs that would go along with it is pretty far fetched. If DnD we're helping save Hasbro's board game/card game sales as much as Magic, then we might be having a different discussion. Either one of vastly increased production schedule or possibly about a new edition.
 

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