D&D 3E/3.5 converting 3e combats to 4e - are they serious?

[Nemesis Destiny]

I ran a game for a group of 3 earlier this year, and aside from the game running really fast, things went smoothly. I will say though that you really have to watch action economy, as others have said.

With only 3 PCs, if one spends a round unable to attack for whatever reason, that really hurts. If one goes down, that's pretty critical. This definitely increases "swingyness" again as others have pointed out.

The party I ran the game for included:
Human Paladin
Human Thief
Changeling Pyromancer

All were level 4. They had control, defence, and damage covered well, and half a leader with the paladin's lay on hands.

I nearly TPK'd them with a fight against an Otyugh and two Carrion Crawlers. It was a level-appropriate encounter, but because the CCs were very good at divide-and-conquer tactics, and lots of action denial with their proning and stunning, it was nearly a wipe. And I'd actually dumbed down the stun to be just more damage instead.

I would definitely do as suggested upthread, and if nobody plays a leader, provide some sort of healing to them, either the daily minor action heal that MortalPlague suggested, or a companion character, or letting everyone use their Second Wind as a move or even a minor action.

You might even houserule that everyone gets to use the Heal skill to trigger others' Second Wind as a minor like the L6 skill power Swift Recovery.

Anyway, just more food for thought. Good luck.

 

[Rechan]

The blackguard changes things a little.

I The bladesinger going avenger changes little (melee, one way or the other) but the blackguard is 1) melee and 2) has Defender-level hit points and high AC. He can Take a Punch.

With only one ranged character, that would mean less emphasis on ranged attackers. One, protected by a soldier (to pin down one of the melee characters) might work. Something with a little more damage punch that goes after the blackguard (like a lurker, skirmisher or artillery) wouldn't be too unreasonable.

And if that player goes Bard, well there goes your healer worries.

But you gotta pin them down and tell them to pick something and stay with it so you can properly prep.

 

[erleni]

The main party I ran was made up of a goliath barbarian, a revenant assassin and an hybrid shaman/druid, so it was heavily leaning on the striker's side and was extremely swingy.
Similar level encounter went from extermination of all monsters in round 1 to three characters below zero HP (so only the revenant still able to act) in round 1 (the infamous behir encounter).
Each PC should have the ability to bring back a dying character without resorting to Heal checks (healing potions work well), because the usual "protect the squishies" tactics work less with small parties and, as pointed up by Nemesis Destiny, when one character goes down then things may really look grim.

 

[Herobizkit]

Ok, got 'em pinned. Final party:

Eladrin Bladesinger (melee)
Vryloka Blackguard (melee)
Warforged Artificer (range)

 

[Rechan]

There you go, you got a healer! The artificer isn't scary at ranged. Depending on what he can do at ranged he's either doing a little area effect, or he's shooting crossbow bolts, neither of which is a going to steal the show like a controller or striker at ranged.

Now that you have a healer on board you can at least relax a hint. A hint. Avoid brutes still (they have poor to-hits and thus will not hit the blackguard, and if they hit the bladesinger he'll easily go down). This brings lurkers and skirmishers into the fold though, and puts a little less emphasis on ranged assailants. However, ranged attackers like artillery or controllers who are defended by hazards/interesting terrain (other side of a river for instance) make for a fun time.

Also you have no one who can throw around AoEs, so don't pour the minions on at the bucketfull. A few will do.

When do you play again perchance?

 

[NewJeffCT]

Also, it makes a big difference on how much rest you allow the party to have between encounters. If you send a wave of encounters at them, they don't get to recharge encounter powers... however, if they have a short rest between encounters (at least), they can spend their second winds to get hit points back and then have refreshed encounter powers. And, after two encounters without an extended rest, the party gets their action points back.

You might want to look into Boons or some other way to give the party healing as well.

 

[Nemesis Destiny]

Good advice; rampant use of minions is a great way to TPK a small party, particularly one with few AoE or multiattack options. I learned this the hard way.

That said, minion use in a striker-heavy group is a great way to either a) give your heavy hitters a few rounds breathing room to do some damage, or b) do some serious damage on their own while the party concentrates on taking down the big guys. In smaller groups, this just kills PCs. In larger groups (6+), it's one of the few ways to actually get to do any damage.

 

[Herobizkit]

Well, we play tomorrow.

For the most part, they'll be fighting either goblins, gnolls, or a combination of the two.

The ankheg encounter will be on the way there.

I guess I'm not in any danger of over-challenging them. Here's why:
a) I got the Blackguard to take the Skald multi-class feat for the healing aura.
b) the Artificer has some healing power.
3) They'll have a Cleric tagalong.

The largest fight I have them in won't have more than 5 or 6 creatures.

I may have altered this slightly, but here's a close breakdown:
* 2 Gnoll guards... Hands of Torog. If they're not careful, they'll pull...
* Yeecha, the Gnoll Firequench Wizard.
* Nearby, but minding her own business, is a Gnoll Mockery priest and her four Goblin snipers. Two snipers may start 'hidden' if the PC's are careless.
* In a slave pit nearby, two Goblin Cutthroats and two more minions hang around.
* If the PC's charge in headstrong, a fairly nasty trap lies in wait for them. A pit trap, 3d10 damage (but easy to see), followed by a hungry Grick in waiting.
* And finally, a big ol' Wight to represent a cursed gnoll in a tomb.

There's also a River trap that could carry some PC's through the wrong end of the cave, and some Brown Mold that will eat a healing surge from someone who is careless.

Admittedly, the adventure is pretty dry... not a lot of fantastic creatures. I cut the adventure here, tho, in the interest of length.

The second half of the published adventure has the PCs encounter a scouting patrol, then assaulting a Gnoll advance party. The culmination comes when the Gnoll War party attacks the town, and depending on how well the PCs treated the townsfolk, may or may not have help.

Also, I wanted to put a skill challenge in there somewhere, but nothing good came to mind.

 

[cignus_pfaccari]

Good advice; rampant use of minions is a great way to TPK a small party, particularly one with few AoE or multiattack options. I learned this the hard way.

Our DM took a while to learn that back in the day. The minion skirmishers volley-firing javelins at ridiculous accuracy in groups of four were kinda mean, especially since we didn't have good AoE or mobility at the time. Reminded me of the darn pygmies from Act 3 of Diablo 2.

Brad

 

[Nemesis Destiny]

Our DM took a while to learn that back in the day. The minion skirmishers volley-firing javelins at ridiculous accuracy in groups of four were kinda mean, especially since we didn't have good AoE or mobility at the time. Reminded me of the darn pygmies from Act 3 of Diablo 2.

Brad

Yeah, it's a pain to do, but minion attack rolls should be figured out one at a time. Accidentally dropping someone to negative bloodied by a volley is not only kind of unfair, but also an inefficient use of monster action economy!

Also, yes, grrr. Damn pygmies! One of the best reasons to play a Strafazon or a Sorc.