Converting True Dragons

Cleon

Adventurer
Looking good.

Environment: Any land? "A castle floating in the wind" isn't a standard environment type. :p
Hmm… I guess so. While Ahi's castle might float over the sea more often than it does land he doesn't live in the water.

Is "Any sky" out of the question? :p

Any thoughts on tactics? I was going with something like "Ahi uses his gaseous form and ability to control the winds and weather to great effect, preferring to deal with his opponents indirectly when possible." Something simple, like Rahab has.
The original entry mentions him using gaseous form to get behind an opponent so I guess we should mention that.

How about.

The steel dragon is an incredibly clever combatant who prefers to deal with enemies indirectly. He uses his ability to control the winds and weather to great effect, often driving away intruders without then ever seeing him. Ahi tends to use magic and breath weapons in combat, although he is not adverse to melee. He often uses his gaseous form ability to hide in clouds or mists, then maneuvers around to attack his enemies from an unexpected direction.
 

freyar

Extradimensional Explorer
Actually, I recently (probably since you wrote this post!) saw "any sky" as an environment line in a Pathfinder Bestiary, so there is sort of a precedent for that! I'm game if you are.

I like those tactics. You just need to change the typo "without then ever seeing him" to "without them ..." ;)

What do we have for description on him?
 

Cleon

Adventurer
Actually, I recently (probably since you wrote this post!) saw "any sky" as an environment line in a Pathfinder Bestiary, so there is sort of a precedent for that! I'm game if you are.

I like those tactics. You just need to change the typo "without then ever seeing him" to "without them ..." ;)
Updating Ahi the Steel Dragon Working Draft.

Come to think of it, I think that then slipped in when I was musing about changing it to "without them even seeing him".

Do you prefer that wording?

What do we have for description on him?
Just the original text's "Ahi's normal appearance to characters and other creatures is as a shifting, cloudy, dragon-shaped mass of vapor".
 

freyar

Extradimensional Explorer
That's great wording!

"You know how clouds sometimes look like animals? This one looks like a dragon." :p Best I got. ;)
 

Cleon

Adventurer
That's great wording!

"You know how clouds sometimes look like animals? This one looks like a dragon." :p Best I got. ;)
Hmm…

A shifting cloud shaped into a dragon. It is too misty and fluctuating to pin down its outline or even position.
 

freyar

Extradimensional Explorer
That's great! Looks like we just have background left, then.

"Like his brother Rahab, Ahi, the Steel Dragon (Draco Ferrosus Carbo), is a unique dragon of unknown origin. Few know his true form, as he often appears as a dragon-shaped mass of gas or mist. Ahi is a noble hermit, living in a wind-borne castle high in the sky. While he doesn't hesitate to use force against intruders, he prefers a peaceful approach..."

Not sure where else to go with this.
 

Cleon

Adventurer
That's great! Looks like we just have background left, then.
Updating Ahi the Steel Dragon Working Draft.

We did agree "Any sky" was OK for the Environment, didn't we?

That's great! Looks like we just have background left, then.

"Like his brother Rahab, Ahi, the Steel Dragon (Draco Ferrosus Carbo), is a unique dragon of unknown origin. Few know his true form, as he often appears as a dragon-shaped mass of gas or mist. Ahi is a noble hermit, living in a wind-borne castle high in the sky. While he doesn't hesitate to use force against intruders, he prefers a peaceful approach..."

Not sure where else to go with this.
I'd cut out the second sentence. A dragon-shaped mass of mist is his true form.

Let's see…

Like his brother Rahab, Ahi, the Steel Dragon (Draco Ferrosus Carbo), is a unique dragon of unknown origin. Ahi looks like a dragon made out of mist. He is naturally solid but can freely switch to gaseous form. In either state, Ahi's appearance is so hazy it is hard to see where he is.

The steel dragon lives above the clouds in a castle that flies around the world on the west wind. Ahi is an inhospitable loner who deals with intruders as brusquely as his lawful good alignment permits. He regularly leaves his castle to hunt for food and seize treasure from evil creatures.

Ahi is 60 feet long weighs 50 tons.

Rahab speaks Draconic, Auran, and Celestial.
 

Cleon

Adventurer
The steel dragon lives above the clouds in a castle that flies around the world on the west wind. Ahi is an inhospitable loner who deals with intruders as brusquely as his lawful good alignment permits. He regularly leaves his castle to hunt for food and seize treasure from evil creatures.
I did wonder about saying "He regularly descends from his castle to hunt for food and seize treasure from evil creatures."

The original text said Ahi "visits the earth" for food and treasure.

Or we could be more literal and use "He regularly descends to the ground to hunt for food and seize treasure from evil creatures."
 

freyar

Extradimensional Explorer
Yes, "any sky" works for the environment.

I like your proposed background pretty well except for the "inhospitable loner" and brusque bit. It just doesn't feel LG enough for a dragon to me. What about this? "Ahi is a hermit who deals harshly with evil intruders and drives off other visitors through more cunning means than direct force." I do like the change to "He regularly descends from his castle..."
 

Cleon

Adventurer
Yes, "any sky" works for the environment.

I like your proposed background pretty well except for the "inhospitable loner" and brusque bit. It just doesn't feel LG enough for a dragon to me. What about this? "Ahi is a hermit who deals harshly with evil intruders and drives off other visitors through more cunning means than direct force." I do like the change to "He regularly descends from his castle..."
Well at least we're agreed on the first paragraph!

I have no objection to removing the "inhospitable" but am not in favour of "hermit" since the word has carries an association with spiritual/religious practices.

How about…

Like his brother Rahab, Ahi, the Steel Dragon (Draco Ferrosus Carbo), is a unique dragon of unknown origin. Ahi looks like a dragon made out of mist. He is naturally solid but can freely switch to gaseous form. In either state, Ahi's appearance is so hazy it is hard to see where he is.

The steel dragon lives above the clouds in a castle that flies around the world on the west wind. Ahi is a loner who deals with trespassers promptly and strictly. He regularly descends from his castle to hunt for food and seize treasure from evil creatures.

Ahi is 60 feet long weighs 50 tons.

Rahab speaks Draconic, Auran, and Celestial.
 

freyar

Extradimensional Explorer
Works for me if you change the "Rahab" in the last paragraph to "Ahi" ;) I'm pretty sure that's a copy-paste thing.

Will that finish him off?
 

Cleon

Adventurer
Works for me if you change the "Rahab" in the last paragraph to "Ahi" ;) I'm pretty sure that's a copy-paste thing.
I don't remember whether it was a copy-past error or because I keep on getting which of these twins is which mixed up.

Updating Ahi the Steel Dragon Working Draft.

Will that finish him off?
I believe so. I'll do a final check of the stats just to be safe…

Well the Full Attack line does not allow for his Multiattack feat and its tail slap should either do 4d6+11 damage or we need a reduced tail damage SA plus Ahi's saving throws are all 4 points too high due to a copy-paste carry-over from Rahab's aura of profane darkness.

Couldn't see any other obvious errors in the stats, although the Keen Senses description has an "It" typo that should be "He".

So, are we keeping the tail damage at Str bonus or giving it a standard True Dragon's 1½ Str bonus?

If we for the +11 damage it'd be a simple matter of adding one of the following SAs:

Reduced Tail Damage (Ex) #1: Ahi only adds his Strength bonus to the damage of his tail slap attack. His slender tail is not powerful enough to add 1½ times his Strength bonus like most true dragons.

Reduced Tail Damage (Ex) #2: Ahi only adds his Strength bonus to the damage of his tail slap and tail sweep attacks. His slender tail is not powerful enough to add 1½ times his Strength bonus like most true dragons.
 

freyar

Extradimensional Explorer
Let's go for the reduced tail damage #2. Maybe we can combine this with the Reduced Bite Damage SQ; maybe call it "Weak Attacks" or something?
 

Cleon

Adventurer
Let's go for the reduced tail damage #2. Maybe we can combine this with the Reduced Bite Damage SQ; maybe call it "Weak Attacks" or something?
I'd be more inclined to keep the "reduced damage" name and just combine the text:

Reduced Bite and Tail Damage (Ex): Ahi only adds his Strength bonus to the damage of his tail slap and tail sweep attacks. His slender tail is not powerful enough to add 1½ times his Strength bonus like most true dragons. Because of his small fangs and weak jaws, Ahi deals bite damage as if he were one size category smaller.

That said, I'm also fine with having them as separate writeups.
 

freyar

Extradimensional Explorer
That's fine. I like the combination; less repetition is better.

The attack line looks ok for Multiattack now, so I guess you fixed it up. :) All done?

Sorry for my disappearance again; I thought I could keep up over a work trip. :p
 

Cleon

Adventurer
That's fine. I like the combination; less repetition is better.

The attack line looks ok for Multiattack now, so I guess you fixed it up. :) All done?
It needs updating to add the Reduced Bite and Tail Damage we'd agreed on, but once that's done we're good to go.

Updating Ahi the Steel Dragon Working Draft.

Sorry for my disappearance again; I thought I could keep up over a work trip. :p
Yes I noticed it's been quite around here recently.
 

Cleon

Adventurer
By the way, since we've slightly updated Rahab the Grey Dragon mechanically I'm thinking we should slightly tweak the flavour text to at least mention he has a brother.

i.e.

Rahab, the Grey Dragon (Draco Nox Diabolus), is among the most hated members of dragonkind. His origins are concealed as well as his true form within the ever-present darkness that surrounds him. Some legends suggest that he's a unique half-black/half-brass dragon, filled with anger toward both factions that gave him life. Other tales suggest he is a failed experiment of Tiamat, or perhaps a former chosen consort that was cast aside for an unknown transgression and forever cloaked in darkness so she need never see him. Still others claim he is a metallic dragon that turned to evil and darkness, or possibly a radiant dragon corrupted by demons. The oldest legend says Rahab hatched from the same egg as Ahi the Steel Dragon and the twin dragons grew up to be complete opposites.
 

freyar

Extradimensional Explorer
In that case, I guess we should take a look at those Mystarans!

Agreed with adding the flavor bit about Ahi to Rahab.
 

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