Creating a d20 rule lite game ala C&C?

[fuindordm]

For people more familiar with D20 maybe the C&C concept of 'primes' could
be expressed differently.

If we think of the primes as giving a character 6 free ranks in all skills related
to that stat, that makes certain primes much more attractive than others when
skills are added to the system.

There are lots of dex-, int-, wis-, and cha- based skills. There are only 3 Str-based
skills and one con-based skill.

So if I wanted a very "skilly" swashbuckling human fighter then I might choose str, wis, and dex as primes to simulate great perception and acrobatic skills. Or int and cha to simulate a noble and tactically brilliant knight.

But if my class is fighter, then these secondary skills never advance. They're stuck at 6 ranks or so (in D20 terms).

I'm just musing out loud here.

So here are a couple of questions:
1) Is it true that secondary skills, represented by the primes but not bolstered by a class feature, never advance as you go up in level?

2) What does a "non-skilly" prime like Con buy you in terms of secondary abilities? Or would that just be taken to boost your saving throws? What does taking Str as a prime get you, other than the ability to jump and swim farther?

--Ben

 

[Turanil]

I too like this streamlined list of skills; it's just that it goes way out of d20 as most people are used to it IMO.

I have thought of adding a bonus (like +3 to all Dex based skills) rather than having a "prime". The problem is that in C&C the prime is also for saving throws, while in d20 saves are handled through sspecific bonuses. As such, doing a "prime" in d20 would make much less sense, and everybody would end up having primes in diplomacy, wisdom, and dexterity.

Well, I prefer to see it simple:
1) Class skills at d20 + modifier + level.
2) Non-class skilss at d20 + modifier.
3) A few special class abilities per class that make sense.
4) A few, optional, and very streamlined feats for people who hope to customize their character a little (but no feat chains).
5) Armors and weapons: each class has access to a specific list (no groups such as "simple weapons" or whatnot), and when someone does want an additional weapon proficiency he can get a very simple feat: "proficiency in one additional weapon of character's choice".
6) Probably no flat-footed or touch attacks (just basic attacks)
7) Rather than attacks of opportunity, when someone in combat divert his atention to do something else, the opponent gets a +2 to hit and initiative; attack of opportunity (i.e.: one free attack) granted in exteme circumstances: opponent turns back and flees.
8) I do keep Action Points, critical hits, and Reputation bonus, because I find it a cool addition to ther game. I also do keep MAS. Lastly, as far as d20 Modern + FX is concerned, I do use Grim Tales spellcasting.

I think everything is there...

 

[Atilary]

I think the idea of primes is good, but the game mechanics used are retarded. It breaks with d20 for a character to lower DCs. Why not just give them a bonus to all skills related to that prime. Its not as though those things inherently easier when they do them, its just they are better at them than others are. Lowering the DCs suggests the task is easier, and doesn't accurately represent that its not the task, but their ability, that is the real difference. Just my two sense, which makes cents to me.

 

[Atilary]

Also, I posted my skill list above for my rules lite d20. I went with trying to group opposed skills into 1 cateygory. It makes sense to me that if someone is good at something, then they would be good at rebuffing that somethign when someone else does it. The skill name doesn't necassary represent the skill ability that well thoguh.... either way this is an interesting thread that should keep going.