D&D 4.0 - What the?

[Acid_crash]

In a 4e I would vote for them to alter the class structure to something more similar to how d20Modern classes work with the Base classes, then Advanced and then Prestige Classes. Have more than one magic system, as much as Vancian magic is to D&D in its importance I personally find this magic system just lame, but that's just my own opinion.

 

[Orius]

I noticed on a different site someone commenting about the possibility of a not too far away 4th edition and thought whoa boy; not that many people have even ventured to 3.5 yet. I'm sure some people here would view the whole idea as preposterous and yet another grab by hasbro for the almighty dollar.

Are you talking about that essay on that Silver Road website or whatever it's called that had a link to it on the front page of EN World? If so I read it and wasn't terribly impressed. It sounded like another "Hasbro's in it for the money, they're going to take away d20, yadda yadda yadda" rant to me. [shrug]

 

[Orius]

I believe that we'll be seeing D&D 4e sometime before 2010. While I can't think of anything major I'd change about D&D, here is a list of things that I feel are too much a part of the D&D expirience to remove:

• Classes
• Levels
• Alignment
• Hit points
• Armor Class
• Vancian Magic
• Saving Throws
• Expirience points
• The six ability scores (Str, Dex, Con, Int, Wis, Cha)

As Rich Baker once said in an interview, if any of these were missing, it just wouldn't feel like D&D anymore.

Oh, I completely agree. Those are definitely sacred cows. I woud include among the sacred cows, the four basic classes: fighter, cleric, rogue, and wizard.

Some people might complain it's not realistic, that it's trite and so on. If they don't like it they can go play GURPS or something.

 

[Zaruthustran]

I think the next version of D&D will be designed with computer and video games in mind--even more so than what we got with 3E.

That means:

1. Clean distinctions between classes, with some new power, spell, or ability at every level.
2. Fast HP recovery. Whether this is through a HP/VP system or whatever, there needs to be a way for adventurers to be able to have more than 1-4 combats per day.
3. Fast spell recovery. See above. Likely a shift a mana point system or a system that achieves the same effect.
4. Feats and feat chains.
5. Fast travel. (cue Eberron)
6. Cooperative feats, spells, and abilities. Tag-team effects.
7. Even more of a trend toward Diablo's limitless magic system, with ways to alter or augment existing items similar to Diablo's Gems system. I expect "Sets" of magic items as well.

I also expect a greater integration of D&D Miniatures, in a way that lets players' D&D characters easily and routinely command troops (a turn-based strategy subgame).

That's the way I'm seeing the wind blowing, anyway.

-z

My #1 wishlist for 4th edition is a faster release schedule for errata and FAQs. 3.5 was supposed to solve all sorts of problems but Infinite Monkeys and our own Rules forum are still filled with arguments caused by inconsistencies in WotC's rules/bad editing. In this day and age of instant publishing via the web there's simply no excuse for multi-month delays between FAQ and errata releases. And it's just sad when The Sage has a less firm grasp of 3.5 rules than an experienced Rules forum member (see latest Dragon magazine question re: two-handed weapons).

 

[Dirigible]

No offense, but you seem to have some inside information the rest of us don't. You speak with such certainty and conviction that I would like to know what other insights you have about Hasbro's grand schemes involving D&D.

I've said it before, I'll say it again... pattern recognition = avoiding tigers!

...here is a list of things that I feel are too much a part of the D&D expirience to remove:
(snip)
Saving Throws
(snip)The six ability scores (Str, Dex, Con, Int, Wis, Cha)

True, but if you look a these two, they have changed very significantly: thd mind-bogglingly nonsensical system of saves vs Death, Paralysation, Rod, Breath Weapon etc. of 1dst and 2nd became something unrecognizibly sleek; and the varying rates of varying bonuses to varying minuteae (and percentiles!) of the 1st and 2nd ed ability scores became a unified bonus.

Is it that you (or Rich Baker) want to keep these things in name, without worrying how they bare no resemblance to their progenitor concepts?

As for changes I'd like to see, RangerWickett's background skills and less magic items sound just super.

 

[Dark Jezter]

I woud include among the sacred cows, the four basic classes: fighter, cleric, rogue, and wizard.

Yeah, I should have included those four. Oh well, I'll mentally add them to the list of D&D sacred cows.

I could also see the ranger class being a sacred cow. While the ranger hasn't always been a part of D&D (and has been changed many times over the years), if WotC tried to remove it in a future edition, the fans would scream bloody murder.

True, but if you look a these two, they have changed very significantly: thd mind-bogglingly nonsensical system of saves vs Death, Paralysation, Rod, Breath Weapon etc. of 1dst and 2nd became something unrecognizibly sleek; and the varying rates of varying bonuses to varying minuteae (and percentiles!) of the 1st and 2nd ed ability scores became a unified bonus.

Is it that you (or Rich Baker) want to keep these things in name, without worrying how they bare no resemblance to their progenitor concepts?

I think it's going a little far to say that saving throw and the ability scores bare no resemblence to the way they were in 1e/2e. Saving throws still help you avoid or lessen the effect of spells, poisons, traps, et cetera, just like they always have. Similiarly, ability scores still affect certain actions and abilites (like strength helping you do more melee damage) the same way they always have.

Saving Throws and Ability Scores work much differently than they did in previous editions (they became much more streamlined and easier to figure out), but they still basically serve the same functions.

 

[Bloodsparrow]

I don't know about the rest of you, but I don't even want to think about a 4.0

Not funny, not funny at all.

 

[Deadguy]

• Reduce the amount of magic items required to adventure. Make a belt of giant strength really mean something because of how powerful it is. Make it so it's unlikely any character would have more than 7 magic items at all. Put the focus on the character's skills, whatever level he's at, not the gear he possesses.

Ummm... isn't one of the main reasons that magic items became so important that the D&D magic system skews character power towards the spellcasters (notably Sorcerer and Wizard)? In other words magic items give other classes a chance to keep up with the spellcasters (e.g. by being able to become invisible, fly, etc.). If we are to avoid games where most PCs are the meatshields for high level mages, it would seem we'd need to radically overhaul the spell system. And that might be slipping into 'sacred cow slaying' territory.

As for 4E, of course they'll publish it eventually. A good many RPG companies have worked that model without complaint. I suspect, after the rancour that the publishing of 3.5E has stirred up, they will wait longer and publish later than otherwise.

 

[Frostmarrow]

I don't know about the rest of you, but I don't even want to think about a 4.0

Not funny, not funny at all.

If we want to influence the creative process we must discuss this now. It's too late to influence Unearthed Arcana, for example, since the book is finished and is just waiting to be printed. So don't bother about buying or not buying right now - just jump in and give us your 2 cents!

 

[Cergorach]

I don't know about the rest of you, but I don't even want to think about a 4.0

Not funny, not funny at all.

Neither do i, but i think that if the past is any inication, we'll see a new version of D&D in another year or 2-3. If this will be D&D 4.0 or D&D 3.5 Revised i don't know, but a company like Hasbro/WotC needs income. The Core Rulebooks are a major income source, so it would seem likely that when the shelf life of the current Core books runs out there will be a new version introduced. I can only think of two reasons why this wouldn't happen: 1.) the shelf life of the Core books is increased by getting more people into the game, 2.) marketing says that releasing a new version is a bad idea because it will hurt sales so much that it's counter productive to release a new version.