D&D is an Adult Game?

[Snoweel]

PS. And, yeah, being a 4E DM I can honestly say I think it's clearly aimed to a younger audience, compared to 3E and 2E. That obviously do not prefent you to using it in a mature game.

As a fellow 4e DM (and squealing 4e fanboy) I totally agree on all counts.

 

[Orius]

I can't think of a single D&D video game that would rate an adult ESRB rating.

From Baldur's Gate on, they've been solidly Teen rated. The things that would push it up to M really aren't really needed in a D&D video game: high levels of profanity, realistic (modern) violence; the ESRB seems to go a little lighter on violence with premodern weapons unless there's buckets of blood, and nudity and sex.

A game like Neverwinter Nights can go full blown AO with the right mods, but that's not exactly out-of-the-box play.

If my mother had seen the 1e AD&D Monster Manual succubus, she would have taken the book away from me an burned it!

Dave. Sutherland. [size=+3]ROCKS.[/size]

Only adults over 21 smoke cigarettes too.

Hook 'em young and keep 'em buying 'til their estate is being settled. With D&D that should be longer (depending on gamer diet )

I was going to say something similar. It's like tobacco, hook 'em when they're young so they keep buying. In this case, there's less health problems though.

Or in a more practical sense, teens are new customers. You got to keep reaching out to new customers or you wan't have any.

 

[jasonbostwick]

Example 3:

WotC seems to want to use 4e to at least to some extent try and get some of the $ that are going into WoW and its ilk, and I have no problem with that. But instead of marketing D+D as an alternative to WoW, why not market it as the end point of a progression in one's gaming life of which WoW was merely a (less mature) phase?

WotC have been marketing D&D as a 'more social' alternative to MMORPGs for quite some time - this ad is from 2005.

I don't have any more recent examples, but I've seen banner ads expressing the same ideas on Penny-Arcade in the last two years or so. I think the tongue-in-cheek jabs at the asocial, 'alone in front of a screen' nature of MMOs are a decent way of showing the advantages of D&D without being overly negative.

I wouldn't like to see them attempt to present it as 'more mature' or 'a progression' from WoW, though. That seems like it would be an approach doomed to failure.

People who are playing MMOs likely are doing it because they enjoy playing MMOs. Trying to tell them that they're 'less mature gamers' would be unlikely to win them over, and would give an impression of D&D as a game for the smug and pretentious.

We all saw the nerd-rage that erupted when WotC disparaged aspects of 3e in the early marketing of 4e - surely WoW players who've played for months or years with their Guild have a similar personal investment in their game.

I think the best approach to market D&D to the 'MMO generation' is what they're basically doing now. Pitch D&D as a fun, social activity where you can be creative with your friends, and present it as an alternative, not a replacement, to MMOs. If you follow Gabe of Penny-Arcade's blogs about his experiences as a new DM, you'll see how this approach can work well to draw in great new players and ideas to the gaming community.

 

[Starfox]

Who but a teen would be attracted by this?

Targeting teens is difficult, because they really don't want to be identified as teens. But things like the Book of Vile Darkness probably has its greatest appeal to late teens exactly because its nominally not for them. And this applies not only to girls in leopard tangas, but also to the academic language of EGG - if you can read that, you are stretching your horizon as a teenager.

Dumbing down works on children and lazy adults. Teenagers don't want things dumbed down.

PS: Ah, I recognize the game in the right-hand sampler as my first DnD edition! And back at 13 when I got it, I think this ad would have had pull with me - except it was never published in Sweden.

 

[DaveyJones]

If I recall right, this is actually Gary's daughter.

you should come to GaryCon II, mang.

 

[Hussar]

I realize that I made a mistake here.

Content =/= marketing. That's totally my bad too because I brought up content in the initial post. The content inside the game is not what I meant. And I totally did not mean that D&D was immature or anything like that as a pasttime. Again, I can see how people could get that from my first post, and, again, totally my bad.

My question is solely about the marketing. Gygaxian prose notwithstanding, 1e was not marketed anywhere other than in teen circles. Comic books, cartoons, TV ads that show teens playing (often with their families), that sort of thing.

That's what I'm questioning.

Whether the actual game is targeted towards this or that audience - well, honestly, I don't think we can get too far there. But, as far as marketing goes, the game has always been pointed pretty squarely at teens.

BTW, Lanefan, do you know why they put the cut off at 35 for 3e? It's because their research showed that after 35, the vast majority of players stop spending money on the hobby. Yes, I know some are the exception, but, this is what they found out. After 35, it doesn't matter what your game looks like, people don't spend money on gaming. So, 3e was designed for people who were going to buy a new game. Playstyles and whatnot had very little to do with it at all. It was all about the money.

 

[Raven Crowking]

That's the spell components list for Disjunction, right? Or was it Bigby's Grasping Hand?

"You must spread some Experience Points around before giving it to the_orc_within again."

 

[Piratecat]

"You must spread some Experience Points around before giving it to the_orc_within again."

Gotcha covered.

 

[Raven Crowking]

My question is solely about the marketing. Gygaxian prose notwithstanding, 1e was not marketed anywhere other than in teen circles. Comic books, cartoons, TV ads that show teens playing (often with their families), that sort of thing.

In that case, based on the evidence available, you may very well be right. Certainly I remember no ads for D&D in Playboy.

 

[billd91]

In that case, based on the evidence available, you may very well be right. Certainly I remember no ads for D&D in Playboy.

How about Heavy Metal or Epic Illustrated? Any ads in those would constitute marketing to adults.

I would consider posters or other flyers and materials in game and hobby stores as marketing to adults.