Dancing Ability +4 Modifier???

[Endur]

From an IC perspective: 90% of PCs have no way of knowing how valuable a magic item is. Very few PCs have the Appraise skill with enough ranks and the magic spells necessary to determine the value of a magical item.

From an OOC Perspective: This is a problem in games if players are concerned about market price, but I'm not sure there is a solution to this problem.

It is the illusion of value teh DMG Market Price guides lead to that is my true problem here. Not the actual Market Price itself.

 

[Vraille Darkfang]

Forgive me if I seem slow, but why are you assuming that the sword doesn't get to attack on the round you loose it? I don't see that explained in the text anywhere.

AH-HA, That would do it. The DMG description states that you can begin the Dancing as a Standard Action (Normally negating any Attack Action you can take). If it DOES start its Full-Attack Action the very round you release it, that maek it more worth it. Also, if it attacks at your BAB (including iterative attacks) each round, whether you take a move action or not... That makes the Dancing ability do some things normally not possible (such as a full attack with a move action).

This would make the Dancing Ability much more versatile and powerful than we have currently been using. That might make it worth the +4 Modifier.

Since the math I used with my 12th lvl fighter showed I do more damage/rd using just my +1 Flaming Burst wpn over the +2 Dancing & +1 Flaming Burst, anything that increases the damage done by the Dancing wpn over those 4 rds makes it a more attractive option. If, instead of getting no attacks when I release the sword the sword gets it full attacks & it gets it full attacks when I take a full rd action, that it'd make it worth it.

I guess the DMG description is just very poorly worded & needs clarification.
Maybe we can get it in the next Errata release.

Vraille Darkfang

 

[Old Gumphrey]

Forgive me if I seem slow, but why are you assuming that the sword doesn't get to attack on the round you loose it? I don't see that explained in the text anywhere.

I have to agree, because, well, he's right. That thing starts chopping the moment you let go of it and attacks in round 1, round 2, round 3, and round 4 before it drops. I can't find any text that says otherwise, and with the +4 enhancement it'd be silly for it to work any other way.

 

[Scion]

So a +5 weapon minimum (50k gp) and a standard action to get in maybe 16 attacks, each with roughly 5% chance to hit for base damage +1?

Lets say it is a two handed sword.. 2d6 base, +1 = avg of 8.

8*0.05*16=6.4 damage.

At the levels we are talking here I dont think that giving up even that one attack is worth that

Making it much larger in pluses really starts cutting into that wealth per level chart..

I am not sure what it should be priced at.. but +4 seems a bit over the top for what it does.

Edit: I know 5% for each swing is a bit low, there will probably be a bit more of a chance for the first swing, but even if we multiply the damage by say 5 it still isnt impressive for a +4 enhancement.

 

[Scion]

sorry all, I just wanted to run through some numbers fun times right?

16th level character, 260k gp

For a 16th level character (the first level where the sword would get 4 attacks in a round) I'll make a little comparison. (str 22, weapon focus)

One character has a dancing weapon (+1, dancing) and a +5 weapon as his primary. (both greatswords)

First round, he releases his dancing weapon and it attacks 4 times.

I'll use a fairly low ac for the enemy, AC 25.

The dancing weapon attacks four times.
+17/+12/+7/+2, against AC 25 this means:
.65*8 + .4*8 + .15*8 + .05*8 = 1.25*8 = 10 damage

Second round - Fourth round
Full attack from the character = +28/+23/+18/+13 (2d6+14, avg 21) = .95*21 + .9*21 + .65*21 + .4*21 = 60.9
Dancing weapon attacks = 10 damage

Total damage from the dancing weapon = 40
Total damage from the character = 182.7
Total damage overall = 222.7

Total gp cost = 100k

Second character, differerent weapon.
+5, energy X (str 22, weapon focus), damage = 2d6+14+d6, avg = 24.5

First round
Move up, swing.
.95*24.5 = 23.275

Second through fourth rounds
.95*24.5 + .9*24.5 + .65*24.5 + .4*24.5 = 71.05

Total damage from the character = 236.425

Total gp cost = 72k

So, for spending 28k less he does 13.725 more damage And that is without any real major equipment or feat investment.

now it is late, so maybe I made some math errors.. anyone see anything blatant?