D&D 5E DM Advice Wanted: Drowning a solo PC Encounter

[HalfAlbinoMidget]

Seeking DM advice for an unusual encounter. I am attempting to attack a PC (solo) via a crazy NPC (solo). This is a specific NPC within Out of the Abyss so I don't want to spoil details of the campaign for potential or ongoing players of that module. I mainly need help with the rules/combat mechanics but some flavor text and considerations are appreciated. I don't want to kill the PC (my safety net items are at the bottom) but I want it to be seen as very dangerous and intense.

Background:
A crazy NPC deliberately gets a PC by his or her self and then attacks them by pushing them off cliffs and narrow ledges, drowning, locking doors while the victim is in a room full of fire/acid/monsters and makes the incidents look like an accident. The method that interested me is something I found in another person's campaign. I plan on attempting to drown the victim PC under the guise of finding treasure.

Encounter setup:
The NPC has noticed the PC loves treasure and will attempt to take advantage of that. While the party sleeps, the NPC locates a large pond in a nearby cavern within the Darklake area (this is in the Underdark BTW). NPC takes stolen treasure and throws it into the pool and will wake the PC and attempt to convince him to split the treasure together and not tell the others (other PCs and NPCs) to get the PC to move solo. I'm confident the player will go for it. I plan on putting a few hints that something is weird as it's being described such as a makeshift raft already built and a giant fire beetle already skewered by a stick (to act like a torch and reveals the glint of metal). Also, I will make the treasure not visible from the shore which requires the raft and get far from the edge (so how did the NPC just stumble upon it?). Maybe toss dirt under the NPCs nails from the digging and building of the raft.

What I foresee:
PC is woken up and examines the cove. NPC boards the raft and looks back expectantly. PC reluctantly boards. Treasure is located (30 feet from shore? 120 feet from shore?) but its very deep (20 feet below?). NPC points out the treasure while on his hands and knees and gets the PC to also kneel down. NPC will then grab the PC by his clothing and push his head into the water while pulling the victim into the water. Once in the water, the NPC will taunt and be psycho (via telepathy) while choking and scratching at the PC ripping hair out and skin off. Once in the water, the PC will obviously resist and we'll need some game mechanics to resolve the event.

I plan on an auto success roll for this grapple attack but afterwards, it's normal dice rolls.

PC can hold his breath 3 minutes, and drowns in 3 rounds (he has a +2 CON modifier) per PHB, drowning rules (not sure page number)

The NPC is content to remain grappling underwater and drown his victims and will remain holding if he can. Would normal grapple rules apply?

Do performing activities (attacking/resisting grapple) reduce the amount of time one can hold their breath?

Does attacking (with axes, daggers and fists) have penalties?

If you get wounded (stabbed?) do you make new checks to avoid spitting out air or similar difficulties?

What I'm trying to avoid is making the encounter too simple (5 feet from the shoreline--PC wins a check and then uses full movement to run down the hall back to camp; or fight normal), or too hard (500 feet from shoreline so even if PC makes his checks, he still doesn't have enough movement/breath to make it back to shore) or excessive (see that glint a mile away--lets get on a conveniently placed makeshift raft. PC will say no and then get help).

To avoid killing the PC
- I'll have a different NPC (#2) notice the psycho NPC (#1) doing weird things and wakes up the party and runs to the cavern (if the PC needs help)
- Shoreline will be filled with float-able items such as zurkwood
- floating debris in the water for the victim PC to latch on to
- stalagmites (the rock formations coming from the floor) just under the water line for the PC to stand on and get his head above water.

If the PC does not go alone, I'll recycle the encounter and use it again the next week or two under a different guise (PCs and NPCs are in boats which get destroyed due to waterfall, water weird, etc and "coincidentally" end up together and will perform the attack while everyone is busy with other events.

 

[iserith]

Give the rules as written, it would likely be exceedingly difficult to drown a PC via grappling them underwater. Three plus minutes of escape attempts will likely succeed at some point. You could rule, as in D&D 4e, that in strenuous situations, such as combat, going without air is very hard. A character holding his or her breath during underwater combat, for instance, must make a Constitution check at the end of his or her turn in which he or she takes damage. Failure results in losing additional hit points or hit dice. But that's not a D&D 5e rule and players with the expectation that you're largely following the D&D 5e rules might be blindsided by such a ruling.

Most attacks underwater suffer disadvantage with the exception of certain weapons mentioned in the Basic Rules, page 77.

 

[Rhenny]

I changed the drowning rules for my games. In my games, as soon as a pc/creature is in a stressful situation while holding its breath, it has to make a Con save (DC 15 or more depending on situation). On a failure, the pc can't hold breath any longer and only has Con modifier rounds before suffocating.

For us, this mechanic works much better because it makes drowning a plausible danger.

 

[Nevvur]

I changed the drowning rules for my games. In my games, as soon as a pc/creature is in a stressful situation while holding its breath, it has to make a Con save (DC 15 or more depending on situation). On a failure, the pc can't hold breath any longer and only has Con modifier rounds before suffocating.

For us, this mechanic works much better because it makes drowning a plausible danger.

I have a house rule downing system to make water environments more dangerous as well, but I think yours is a little more elegant in execution while arriving at mathematically similar results. Thanks for sharing, I'll bring it to my group.

 

[MonsterEnvy]

They only get a minute underwater if they succeed in holding their breath. If they can't prepare for it or are being forefully suffocated I just say they have their con mod in rounds to get out of it before dropping to 0 hp.

 

[HalfAlbinoMidget]

Great thoughts. I meant wrote this earlier but had a network error. :

Turning this into a chase encounter (once PC escapes the grapple) and/or skill check would be interesting. Ideas?

 

[iserith]

Great thoughts. I meant wrote this earlier but had a network error. :

Turning this into a chase encounter (once PC escapes the grapple) and/or skill check would be interesting. Ideas?

If the player decides his or her character runs away, there are rules for handling Chases in the DMG, page 252.

 

[Quartz]

A question for you: is this going to be fun? For the PC? And for the group? If the answer to any is no, then don't do it.

 

[Rhenny]

Like iserith said.

For the chase, you can have the PC make a series of checks depending on what he/she is doing. Most of them will probably by Strength (Athletic) checks, but you can always switch it up and allow attempts for Dexterity (Athletic) if it seems like the task could use that attribute. Of course, some of the checks might be Dexterity (acrobatics), and after a little while, maybe a Con (Athletics) for endurance or something like that.

To make it really interesting, you'll need to introduce complications and benefits depending on how the rolls go. Be sure to describe the scene and give the player the ability to make choices. Let the player tell you what the PC is trying to do and just tell them what to check. PC should be able to pick a path that might be more or less difficult to traverse. PC should be able to try to hide (and when he fails have the chaser jump out and scare the PC to death..pushing the chase on or just have the two resolve their encounter).

Use your best judgment and be sure to use descriptive detail to add flavor. Oh, also, my advice is to make the whole chase an abstraction (theater of the mind) rather than using minis on a board. I think you can make it more exciting by having player visualize rather than square counting.

As for using weapons underwater, rules state that any weapon that isn't a piercing weapon will incur disadvantage to attack underwater. (There may be other restrictions in PHB/DMG, but I can't remember them off the top of my head).

 

[Ovinomancer]

I'd be very cautious with this kind of encounter -- unless you foreshadow it so well that the player slaps their own head for being so obviously stupid, they're more likely to learn to not trust you than have fun.

Betrayals of NPCs can be a very interesting and rewarding plotline. However, from the player's perspective, it's more fun to discover the betrayal and counter it than be blindsided by it. Therefore, as a DM, you need to be extra mindful about how you approach these events. Your thinking shows that you're more interested in nailing down the rules coffin to kill a PC than providing an interesting encounter for that PC. In other words, by focusing on the how of the drowning, your missing that the encounter should be about discovering the NPC is crazy and dealing with the fallout from that rather than desperately trying to survive a DM orchestrated ambush.

I'd strongly advise reconsidering the outcome of this encounter. Heavily foreshadow it, with the NPC chuckling or giggling while still onshore while talking about going out to get the treasure and how good an idea that is. Crazy people do not often do well acting normal for long periods of time, and especially near their triggers. At the point of the encounter, if the PC rashly continues, I'd have the NPC spout off a bit on the mad plan before attacking, rather than having the initial grapple and submersion being automatic (personally, as a player, I would hate this). This gives the PC a chance to make a bad choice on their own -- dive in and try to swim back to shore, try to throw the crazy NPC off and paddle back on the raft, or trying to fight the NPC. Much more dynamic and allows the player to make bad choices rather than you dictating a bad outcome without a choice.

In other words, I'd suggest making this encounter much less about the NPC's plan going the way the NPC wants, and more about the the PC discovering and thwarting the NPC's plan. If I've learned anything over a few decades of DMing, its that your players will add all of the bad choices you could possibly want -- you don't need to work hard to force them.